Liquifier madness 2k coven.

I call this my "Circle of six". for fun games mostly.

HQ

Heamonculus: (70) Liquifier gun, Power Weapon.
Heamonculus: (70) Liquifier gun, Power Weapon.
Heamonculus: (70) Liquifier gun, Power Weapon.

Heamonculus: (70) Liquifier gun, Power Weapon.
Heamonculus: (70) Liquifier gun, Power Weapon.
Heamonculus: (70) Liquifier gun, Power Weapon.

TR

[5] Wracks: (160) Acothyst, Flesh gauntlet, Liquifier gun.
-Raider- Flickerfield.

[5] Wracks: (160) Acothyst, Flesh gauntlet, Liquifier gun.
-Raider- Flickerfield.

[5] Wracks: (160) Acothyst, Flesh gauntlet, Liquifier gun.
-Raider- Flickerfield.

[5] Wracks: (160) Acothyst, Flesh gauntlet, Liquifier gun.
-Raider- Flickerfield.

[5] Wracks: (160) Acothyst, Flesh gauntlet, Liquifier gun.
-Raider- Flickerfield.

[5] Wracks: (160) Acothyst, Flesh gauntlet, Liquifier gun.
-Raider- Flickerfield.

FA

[5] Scourges: (130) Haywire blaster x2.

[5] Scourges: (130) Haywire blaster x2.

[5] Scourges: (130) Haywire blaster x2.

HS

Ravager: (115) Flickerfield.

Ravager: (115) Flickerfield.

~~~

Plain to see where everything is going. I tryed to balance AI and AT, also added some Sharp jabs to the chest to kill those monsterous guys and multiple wounds. what do you think?

that sounds fun. delicious, face melty fun.

I like it.

However I think you can definately save points in your Wrack unit upgrades. I'm not sure you're really going to see much benefit from the Acothyst especially those $$$ Flesh Guantlets (a weapon I love).

You have the Haem's and PWs so you have some armor and FNP denile already in each unit. You have lots of Poison so a high T10 is no scarier than a low one T3.

Trim some of that fat and you have 180 points back.

That could get you a 3rd Ravager and say some fatties.

What about (keeping true to your theme).....

5x Haemonculus - Liquifier & Power Weapon

4x Grotesques - Liquifier, Aberration & Flesh Gauntlet
- Raider - DL , FF, TGL

5x Wracks - Liquifier
- Raider - DL, FF, TGL

5x Wracks - Liquifier
- Raider - DL, FF, TGL

5x Wracks - Liquifier
- Raider - DL, FF, TGL

5x Wracks - Liquifier
- Raider - DL, FF

5x Wracks - Liquifier (the "No Haemonculus unit")
- Venom - SCx2, FF

5x Scourges - Haywire Blasters x 2

5x Scourges - Haywire Blasters x 2

5x Scourges - Haywire Blasters x 2

1x Ravager - 3xDL, FF

1x Ravager - 3xDL, FF

1x Ravager - 3xDL, FF

2000pts

The core is really 1980 with 20pts left over I just took what I think would be the best use of those 20 points; that being TGLs on 4 of the boats. Why I like TGLs in this list is because if you intend on being up close and personal spraying folks. That -1 LD is nice, not to mention it also helps by giving those boats a chance to avoid HtH, and annoys Libs that find themselves to close.

I also lost a Haem in order to squeeze in a unit of Grots and another Ravager which I feel is totally worth it (IMO). Because of that I switched out one of the Raiders for a Venom since you no longer needed a transport that held more than 5 for that unit.

You could with that 15pts give a Haem (the one attached to the Grots) a Shattershard to add the best single shot weapon in the game to your list (IMO).

You could mix in a few GTs to help with LD rolls if your units find themselves out of the boat (and no more Acothyst LD9).

I agree with Fletch's version. its much better.

Only thing I might do different is drop the Power weapons and go with NS on the raiders but those PW could be useful. Not sure, but its a thought. I'd really have to test it out to be sure.

Well to be honest i would say dont bother changing anything. That lists looks fantasticly fun to play. And if you are mainly using it in casual fun games i wouldnt bother optimising it.

Yea it is amazingly fun to play this list, ppl are scared when they see all those liquifiers melting there squads. It is insightfull to see an optimized version of the list. Might try it out sometime but for now ill keep it as it is. Just wanted to see what ppl thought of the list.

Please put up at least an overview of how that list runs in a game.

Well so far I ran up against nids and some genestealer cult list. Did well with nids took out most of his termagants and warrior broods. Had a little trouble with the big boys tho, I ended up killing tervigons and the like but my squad was ether left with a model or two or completley got wiped. (that's why I added flesh gauntlets didnt have them before) rather just kill them and be on my way then stay stuck fighting, have better things to do... We did not get a chance to finish but I was winning in kp. Against the weird cult list there was no contest I shot or stunlocked most of his tanks and flamered the rest. Yet again he had some monsterous and that gave me some trouble. Had agoniers then but they failed to do much and got trampled by them. He got lucky with regen rolls and went on to destroy another squad /sigh. The genestealers did a lot of damage when I got stuck in combat but other then that I just sprayed the rest and they died quickly. This game also took long so we were unable to finish. So after these two I changed it up and added the flesh gauntlets. There is a lot of b angels and multiple wounds armies with fnp and the like so I think the gauntlets are a better choice for me.

"rather just kill them and be on my way then stay stuck fighting, have better things to do..."

One of the best quotes ever.

Yanked for sigi.

so far i just did some small squad on squad and squad against monsterous fights and the flesh gauntlets do well. i ether end up killing it fast or on their turn most of the time. i am happy with disabling fnp also its quite a pain some times. i'll post some other overviews later usually play on wednesdays, sometimes saturdays. if anyone else has an opinion on making the list better post it, i would like to see if it has the potential to be tornament worthy. very fun to play as it is tho

Nice thanks for the updates.

I have a few Coven theme lists I like and I was thinking about how to take your shell and modify it more. I'll make my own thread (in the not so distant future) but don't be surprized if it similiar.

that's cool I would like to see what you will do with your version of the list, also how it does.

Do you run your Acothyst equip'd with the Liquifier?

In essence putting the Liquifier on the Acothyst means you also have one less model for unique wound allocation so the small unit needs to take 5 wounds before having to roll against the Acothyst (armed with Liquifier) or Haemonculus instead of 4 wounds making you then pick between your Liquifier guy, Acothyst or Haemonculus and risk lossing one or wounding your Haem. Downside of course is "all eggs in one basket" so if you do end up loosing the Acothyst you've lost your Liquifier and Flesh Guantlet.

Also since you went with another special CCW weapon in the Flesh Gauntlets and you don't get to take advantage of the +1 attack bonus anyway loosing that second poisoned CCW doesn't impact him, he is still 2 attacks, 3 on the charge.

Also on that note have you thought about taking the Acothyst and going all out "Tackelberry mode" (reference to Police Academy sorry in advance)? I was thinking to maximize the wound allocation and his potential attacks in HtH to take this load out for the Acothyst: Liquifier and Splinter Pistol, he still keeps 1 of the Poisoned CCW and pistols no matter what they do are treated as just normal CCW in HtH. So now you have an Acothyst who can lay down a nasty template against mass troops or pop a shot against a single tuff guy (more than likely use the LG). Then in HtH he has 3 base 4 attacks on the charge wounding on 4+ (Pistol and Poisoned CCW).

Regardless of where you put the Liquifier I'm thinking if you are limited in space say a venom (so you cant just take a 6th Wrack) or just like the idea of LD9 in your Wrack unit the Acothyst with Splinter Pistol is a nice cheap 15 point upgrade to net the unit 2 more HtH attacks and another not so shabby shot (if he's not holding the Liquifier) as well as a bonus to the units LD. Otherwise if your not maxed on space or care about the bonus LD, buying a Wrack is a cheaper way to net you 2 attacks 3 on the charge not to mention another wound.

Whatcha think?

I usually just run them separate and make myself choose wich would be more useful to me and get rid of the lesser. It is a good idea taking the LG and a pistol to get that extra attack in. I was under the impression that the acothyst does get the extra attack because both weapons fall under the same category "poison weapons" the only difference is one instant kills and the Other does not. Have I been interpreting it wrong? If not I might have to take your suggestion and run the acothyst with both. Otherwise I think it is a very good alternative and maxes out the potential for a five man wrack unit.

As you know he only ever gets one "character upgrade" i.e. either a Flesh Guantlet, Agonizer, Hexrifle, Stinger Pistol, etc.

The Stinger Pistol is classified as type pistol even though it shoots poisoned shots that wound on a 2+ it is treated like any other pistol in HtH being as a "normal" CCW. No different than a Smurf armed with a Plasma Pistol and Power Weapon, they still benefit from the offhand bonus as the Plasma Pistol is treated as a regular CCW and not a "complex CCW"

Now typically this wouldn't offer any bonus to the Acothyst since he starts with two poisoned CCWs and already has the built in +1A off hand bonus. It matters when and if you decide to put something on him. The Stinger Pistol along with the Hexrifle are the only options that still allow the Acothyst to keep a +1 offhand bonus, everything else is an additional "special" CCW that cannot be combined with his 2 poisoned CCWs. (Scissorhand gives a seperate +1A bonus). However if you choose to put the Liquifier on the Acothyst he has to drop one of his poisoned CCWs so picking up the Stinger (not the Hexrifle) is the only choice for the Acothyst to retain his +1A offhand attack bonus.

I was leary about the whole "can the acothyst take a liquifier" but it seems there is a lot of net traffic on this and the overwhelming majority as in agreement that he can with very very few decentors. Its not like the old codexs anymore where it used to state, upgrade trooper X to unit leader Y replacing their basic gear with this gear. This is simply upgrade Wrack Y to a Liquifier and then upgrade Wrack Y to Acothyst (i.e. they dont have their gear replaced or he would in essence start without his 2 poisoned CCWs either)

Yeah he should be able to take it because it states that any wrack from the squad can take the liquifier. Sucks that he might loses the extra attack with the gauntlet. Guess I'll just have to live with it for now. Still in the testing stages.

LoneZealot wrote:

Yeah he should be able to take it because it states that any wrack from the squad can take the liquifier. Sucks he loses the extra attack with the gauntlet. Guess I'll just have to live with it for now. Still in the testing stages.

Well if you give him the FG and the Liquifier his number of attacks wouldn't necessarily change from if he had just the Flesh Guantlet (unless you were giving him the bonus for an off-hand).

Since his two CCWs are poisoned they are "special" CCWs as well as the Flesh Gauntlet is a "special" CCW. Now it seems the concensus is that the FG is a different "special" weapon than his base CCW with poison and as such cannot be combined for the off-hand bonus - i.e. 2 attacks if you choose to use the Flesh Gauntlet.

Now without getting into a full on rules debate I'm of the mindset that specials are simply classified by type as evident on pg 42, those classifications being (Poison, Power Weapon, Power Fist, Lightning Claw, T. Hammer, Rending and Wyche Blades). Most if not all special CCW weapons fall with one of these categories. With that in mind when it goes into fighting with multiple single-handed weapons IMO it is simply referring to "class" when it is referring to the concept of same special weapon. So two poisoned weapons are just two poisoned weapons and you receive a bonus, as opposed to say a poisoned weapon and a power weapon, i.e. two seperate weapons in their complexity which typicaly relates to how other rules are applied (i.e. no armor save, double str, attack at I1) which defines what type of "special" weapon they are classified as. I mean if a model had say 2 power weapons and one was master-crafted (meaning its not "exactly" the same as the other) I wouldn't see why the player shouldn't get a +1A bonus as well as the ability to reroll one attack. I mean seriously where is the "complexity" as they are the same class same damage roll the only thing is they are not "exactly" the same weapon by absolute description. So either way someone reads it, I don't care.

I just wanted to say, that at its heart, this thread is about the specific application of absurd cruelty upon others.
I approve.

Yeah I was under the impression that the acothyst would get the extra attack since both weapons are classified as poison. The flesh gauntlet just has the extra effect. that's how I've been running it and so far no one has told me otherwise. /shrug. I'll just have to make sure once I start running this list in tournaments.

LoneZealot wrote:

Yeah I was under the impression that the acothyst would get the extra attack since both weapons are classified as poison. The flesh gauntlet just has the extra effect. that's how I've been running it and so far no one has told me otherwise. /shrug. I'll just have to make sure once I start running this list in tournaments.

I'm with you, I'd feel totally comfortable running it with the extra attack until told otherwise. Given that don't give him the Liquifier.

At least we have a back up plan, if someone with the authority says no I'll just throw the acothyst the liquifier and call It a day.

Update- did a match yesterday against SW. Ended up pretty bad we did an adepticon mission and I lost. It was victory points on non troop units, board control, and something else but I forgot. I whiffed on all my DL and HB shots /sigh right there ruined the game. I basically had to wait till his troops just got out of the transport. (Immobilized some of his vehicles at least) once he was out I melted two troops and some scouts off the board with the LG's but it was little to late and most of my army was down walking or destroyed. Was a fun game but a little disappointing with all those misses. Guess if I want this to work against competitive list it needs a bit more AT. Still fun to play as it is tho

Yeah if he runs a parking lot list and you can't get those transports cracked it's not going to go good regardless.

Sux the dice gods chose not to smile upon you. Unfortunately building lists that you may find fun and interesting arn't always as forgiving when your dice break bad.

I would give the list a few more shots before you start any major tweeks, IMHO.

Yeah I will. A few more games and I'll see what's holding my list down.