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| | Agony Engines |  |
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PartridgeKing
Sybarite
Posts : 253
Join date : 2011-11-08
 |  Subject: Agony Engines  Tue Jan 20 2015, 18:00 | |
| "Greetings to you all, step up, step in, come and browse the peak of artistry that is the work of the Shattered Helix. Come on, come in. Our installations will not bite. Not you. Not yet. Marvel in their darkest curves, the stretch of well stitched flesh, our cavalcade of horrors. Our myriad Engines of Agony"Ril'ck Intercessor for the Shattered Helix After festering in my head for likely more than a full perambulation around the sun, the idea I’ve had for a project has started to come to full bloom. It’s been a pet project of mine thus far to consider the Talos & the Cronos and think about what else the Haemonculi Covens might make. Originally we had the Talos – Pain Engine that was described as having a variety of different forms but a similar function, the rendering down of enemy combatants into the constituent parts that would be useful to the Haemonculi, as well as a kind of gigantic torture device. Then in 2008 we gained the Cronos – Parasite Engine, again with the implication that it could take many different forms but had one consistent function, the stealing of life in its most ethereal and ephemeral sense to feed its dark masters This to my mind set a precedent and a format:
- Name (with the [Vowel]-[Constenant]-os ending)
- And then a clearly defined function that could be represented in a number of different forms and ways.
It also produced a problem, for me at least, you’ll notice I’m a bit of a pedant when it comes to certain things, up until the Cronos came on the scene we all referred to ‘Pain Engines’ as the collective term for multiples, and rightly so, even if we called it something different all our large constructs were effectively Talos – Pain Engines by a different form and thus it made sense to use the collective. However with the appearance of the Cronos we can’t – technically – use that term as a catch-all anymore. If we refer to multiple Pain Engines we’re talking about multiple Talos, and if we talk about multiple Parasite Engines we’re talking about multiple Cronos. Thus a new collective term was needed. Way back when I started writing up with the fluff of my Kabal & Coven I coined the term Agony Engine. I think it was my own creation, but if I nabbed it off someone else then my apologies for forgetting who! To my mind it was a logical extension of the term as Agony could be considered a broader more catch-all term that represented more than just base pain and was familiar enough to be easy to pick up. Thus a useful term, and more importantly the seed of an idea. As indicated the idea’s taken a long time to be fully expressed and though a lot of planning has happened thus far I’ve got no further. Said idea is briefly as follows: “If we have Talos & Cronos, what other Agony Engines might exist?” So over the past year I’ve been quietly designing additional Agony Engines that the Haemonculi covens could be producing, with an eye to what purpose they fill for the Haemonculi, because though both of our original ones are collectors as much as destroyers there’s no reason why the Covens couldn’t specifically be making things to other purposes. To bring the previous lengthy monologue to a close prior to my departing off on another linked monologue. I’m now at the point of putting my thoughts into action and words and thus below is a load of information regarding the Agony Engines I’ve been thinking of and my design & modelling ideas. In addition to general modelling and fluff ideas I've been trying to build them - in my head at least - with actual table top rules that opponents might let me use or that could be interesting for quick Coven vs Coven skirmish games. Thus many of the designs take that into account in an attempt to balance them and represent what they do at least vaguely to a casual observer. Actual rules aren’t being posted here but the rough ideas might be. I’m posting this to see what people think of the general idea, as well as get opinions and feedback on my specific designs. #AgonyEnginesI’ve split each Agony Engine idea up into its Name and function in the Name – Type of Engine format, with a brief in setting blurb about it. Then there are the design themes or ideas I’ve been running with in a conceptual way, as much as the why it might look like something, as what it would look like to the Dark Eldar and their enemies and a bit of discussion as to what it does and any fluff thoughts regarding this. Finally there’s a section on the modelling specifics, that’s as it says on the tin if I have a specific plan for how I’m going to model that particular Agony Engine I will detail it, including what bits I’m thinking etc. I’ve spoilered each section as this is already a massive post and I wanted to allow people their own thoughts without my design specifics colouring their mental image. So to that end and without too much further-ado: Moros - Assassin EngineThe Moros is created for one purpose, to hunt down and slay specific individuals. Artificial assassins these constructed creatures are each individual, and though intended to function against multiple potential targets in its lifetime most are initially built to settle a specific grievance. The Haemonculi are spiteful beings and it is often possible to estimate the Moros’ original target – assuming success – from the specific design of the Engine. - Design Theme / Fluff::
As something deriving from the Greek personification of impending doom, assassination seemed to fit, and being the smallest of the Agony Engines likewise. I think the needs of assassination being multiple I can imagine Moros taking many different forms, but generally being smaller and more able to both in & ex - filtrate the target areas.
- Modelling Specifics::
I already have a model for, something I'd found on Ebay and it seemed an interesting idea, though a very simple conversion. Mine is a Cryx Cankerworm with additional Hormagaunt talon arms. As I say, simple but it works. And it fits the more serpentine themes of my Master Haemonculus.
Minos – Control EngineTrue to its appellation the Minos has been created to subvert others ability to act independently, to manipulate the foe and field on which it finds itself and thus control & corral potential enemies or slaves to the ends of their new masters. - Design Theme / Fluff::
Though potentially equipped with a variety of different ‘control’ tools to me the main weapon of the Minos is a series of 'Neural Control Hooks' that are fired on harpoon like projectiles - with attendant cabling - to subvert the motor function of those they hit turning them into fleshy puppets it uses to support itself in combat, perform action it would otherwise be unable to etc. (quite like a brain-leaf plant in many ways) as well as other arcane wargear allowing it to manipulate or control enemies in some fashion. Ideas prior to the generation of the dedicated Nightmare Engine or our latest codex had been something like the old Horrorfex. Due to the broad nature of ‘control’ or ‘enslavement’ – which could be considered synonymous in terms of the Minos – I see it as a very ‘arcane’ and esoteric Agony Engine, one that uses a lot of very different technology and possibly the most mechanical of the lot.
- Modelling Specifics::
As for actual design features, some large series of ranked spines or obvious firing chambers for the control hooks had featured – my head had stuck on the large shield-esque fleshborer hive tyrannofex arms as a basis, possibly with embellishment – and though originally I’d imagined it as a floating chassis, like the majority of the Agony Engines, I can see interesting ambulatory ideas. Judging from the notes I have on the matter this was one of the more technologically arcane Agony Engines and I’d been looking at using something like a shockprow as a ‘head’ to represent a large head-mounted ‘control weapon’ - additionally, though I’ve never played the ‘Silent Hill’ games, it would give it a ‘pyramid-head’ feel which might work quite well as I hear that he’s considered a fairly powerful awe/fear inspiring individual – giving it an almost shark-like aspect. The chassis itself I’d not decided on, though continuing an arcane-technology design I’m drawn to the idea of a tail akin to the new Necron Wraiths – something I need to look into in any case for the pain-engine sized master Haemonculus of my Coven – which I’ve seen some interesting Talos & Cronos conversions using them.
As I’ve been writing this up over a few days I’m now planning – bits allowing – to build this with a shock-prow ‘head’ attached to a main body built from a Morghast Harbinger/Archus and a Necron Wraith tail. The tyrannofex weapon arms I’m undecided as to how I’m going to attach as yet and it may be just as arms or I might try and make them integral to the Control Engine’s body.
Deimos - Nightmare EngineDesigned to feed upon the fears and terrors of the foes, drawing them in before projecting them back in an amplified form that causes enemies to flee, cower or even die of fright. - Design Theme / Fluff::
To my mind a Deimos is a floating crucible of nightmares. An armoured chassis that – like an upturned glass thrust into water – holds a captured bubble within it that feeds its weaponry. Pockmarked with collection vanes and sensitive membranes that collect and draw in the imprint fear leaves on the world around it, as enemies panic it becomes more and more empowered. It should either be obviously horrifying to look at or clearly have weapons to cause fear.
- Modelling Specifics::
Talos / Cronos main armour section, but with front and back swapped. Underside greenstuff with draeyd heads and potentially pink horror jaws thrusting from it – the nightmare stuff barely given form translated into horrifying images in the minds of those who look at it –Forgeworld Corsair jetpack vanes in the small ‘sockets’ along the top of the armour. A cluster of three vanes on either side in the ‘arm socket’ of the armour, potentially using the ‘hip’ canisters as a base.
Atropos – Termination EngineAn alternative to the Moros the Atropos is also intended to bring death to a specific target but where a Moros strikes with subtlety an Atropos does so with brutal and terminal force. If a Moros is the stiletto in the dark that finds its target and lays them low, the Atropos is the bomb in the target’s chamber that obliterates them, their bodyguards and the spire section they happen to occupy. - Design Theme / Fluff::
Just as no two Haemonculi are the same the Atropos is similar to the Moros in that each is built with its master’s specific proclivities and preferences to the fore. Probably as small or even smaller than the Moros an Atropos would be one of the smallest of the Agony Engines due to – in most cases at least – its one use nature. Whilst the likelihood of any Haemonculus fitting the device with something as mundane as explosives, the type of esoterica weaponised within are probably just as likely to obliterate the Engine as the target.
To my mind – if we’re thinking game mechanics influencing model design – this would have my ‘Clockwork Killer’ rule making it to all intents and purposes a piece of wargear for a Haemonculus, just one that, like the Moros, operates off by itself. To that end, unlike the Moros’ special deployment I see the Atropos being brought along with the Haemonculus and their final adjustments being done when a target is in sight which will send the Atropos off to its – hopefully messy – end. In short deploys as normal and then needs some way of tracking and reaching its target as well as the large primary one use weapon. Also being cruel, though the Atropos isn’t designed to kill in combat it is probably set to ‘detonate’ if it’s slain.
- Modelling Specifics::
For my own I’m imagining an oblate body with no clearly defined front or back and myriad scuttling legs – this may end up being a small chassis that I magnetise to be able to add larger sections to, to allow it to represent multiple different Agony Engines – scuttling legs with body mounted darkness-blind gas grenade launchers for the Erebos anyone?
Again as design thoughts have progressed – and what parts I have, or will have, has changed – I think I’m going to use the Tervigon birthing sac upside-down as the main body with legs coming off it. This may make it bigger than originally envisaged so I’ll have to look when I have parts in my hands, though the legs might end up being many and small, which might mitigate this.
Tartaros – Damnation EngineSo named for the triplicate damnation it represents, firstly that of its intended purpose, to punish those psykers who touch the Immaterium by causing warp instability and psychic feedback, secondly that of the alternative use this destabilising of the local warp can lead to, the release of daemonic entities into the material plane, and finally that which comes to the user, for a Damnation Engine’s mere creation breaches the edict of the Dark City that forbids psykers and psychic powers and thus any who might think to use one would be best to ensure none live to tell of it. - Design Theme / Fluff::
Originally sitting in my head as two separate ideas, a Warp Engine & an Instability Engine, intended to allow a smattering of access to the psychic phase for fun via Malefic Daemonology and to act as a psychic defence respectively in my head the two have finally come together into one idea, which the Damnation Engine seems to work as both.
Discussions as to the Fluffiness of Eldar – of any flavour – summoning Daemons and the fact that we’re Dark Eldar not having psykers is one of our things I’d prefer to put aside for now. I’m more than happy to discuss it just preferably not in this thread. Suffice to say to me there’s enough of an argument for such things that the idea seemed worthwhile to consider.
For what it does in a more specific sense, the concept of an area where the Warp is made weaker or producing psychic ‘white noise’ that’s distracting and damaging to the careful ritual psychic practices of most psykers, to the extent that their powers more easily go wrong. To my mind the progression of this localised instability is when the walls between real and immaterial actually break down and the daemons come out, obviously this is a dangerous practice for everyone nearby so I’d expect the Tartaros performing this function would be built to either a minimalist aesthetic – if the daemons destroy it too it’s less of a concern – or are massively over-engineered to allow a small amount of control or protection of the daemons. How to represent this is something I’m unsure of as yet.
As to general ideas as to how it should look, I’ve been in two minds as to whether the Tartaros could just be the same model as the Deimos, ‘half formed nightmares poking through the veil that your eyes refuse to see’ is a handy description of the warp as much as anything else. Since then I’ve also thought that the Atropos might also work if it’s a huge mutated psyker brain amalgam created from psykers and parasites like Medusae by the Haemonculi, the addition of the large brained packmasters from the new Stormfiends – with minor modifications to make them look less like rats – would add to this and has the potential as magnetisable options to it.
- Modelling Specifics::
No set plan due to thoughts in Design Theme section.
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|  | | Marrath
Wych
Posts : 694
Join date : 2014-01-01
Location : A very spiky Webway-Hulk
| | Subject: Re: Agony Engines Tue Jan 20 2015, 20:27 | |
| I really like the idea! Your Moros would make a good plausible count-as-Assassin alternative. And i can see your Minos engine work quite well, i mean when Daemons can turn your units into Daemons, a rule that lets you take control of your enemy's units should be completely fine. About that Termination Engine, do suicide bomber units exist in 40k yet? If they don't, they should! Even before you started this, i was thinking about a Phobos Fear Engine (although Phobos/Fear is probably redundant  ) It could use hallucinogenic gas and the Harlequin holo/mask-technology that shows the victim their worst nightmare, and employ them along the lines of your Deimos Nightmare Engine. It would look rather blank like the Harlequin masks, a canvas for the opponent's inner fears. And a Hades Hell Engine, although it breaks the [Vowel]-[Constenant]-os ending rules :pardon: I haven't thought about more than the name until now, maybe a Daemonic design and lots of flamer weapons. I hope i don't encroach upon your thread by posting my ideas. | |
| | | | PartridgeKing
Sybarite
Posts : 253
Join date : 2011-11-08
| | Subject: Re: Agony Engines Wed Jan 21 2015, 08:24 | |
| @MarrathThankiesai, I'm glad you like the idea and please let me say first and foremost that I'm up for anyone and everyone posting their own idea, recommendations for my designs and even their own brand new creations within the theme of Agony Engines! Please go right ahead and thank you for adding to the discussion! I think all the assassin models come on small bases but I don't see why it couldn't be used as one, an Eversor seems to fit given the shredding, brutal murder. Forge World produce(d) a tiny 'tank' that could be carried around in a Chimera and then drove off and detonated in your face in the past, and one could make a good go at claiming Spore Mines are doing similar. The Deimos was originally called the Phobos but as you say it ends up feeling a little redundant and 'nightmare' to me at least felt like a progression from and beyond 'fear'. Glad to hear I'm not the only one who's been thinking along these lines too. In regards to your idea the back plate armour of the Talos/Cronos kit does look rather mask-like if you up end it by 90 degrees, you just need to decide which way is to be up and then work out a body.  sounds like an interesting way of doing things to me for certain! I like that too - ages back I'd had an idea involving Coven Ravagers which ended up in the territory of Medusae or Liquifier sponsons or some form of giant Medusae 'jet-bike' amalgam so something with some form of immaterial flame would be very cool. Speaking of which generic flame is notably absent from the Dark Eldar weapons, barring the Heat Lance - unless I'm forgetting something - we've not actually got any other heat derived weapons, and napalm, white phosphorous etc are definitely 'cruel' enough to fit the Dark Eldar design preferences. How do you think you'd design your Hades (or equivalent name)? Also on the naming front if it helps whilst deciding on what to call the Moros I actually went through Classical Greco-Roman mythology looking for other names that match Talos & Cronos – as both are references to Greco-Roman myths – and found a lot of potential additional options which could be thought about as well and though currently they’re barely actual ideas in my head, I’d be interested to see if they peak anyone else’s interest, or help with ideas. 1-3 letters-[Vowel]-[Constenant]-os Corus - surfeit, disdain Dolos - cunning, treachery Limos - starvation Momus - mockery, blame, censure Nomos - law Ponos - toil Poros - expediancy, device Thrasos - boldness Zelos - rivalry, envy, zeal Erebos – darkness (something with gas/smokescreen grenades is springing to my mind here, with the option of firing at friend or foe with similar effects – but mitigatable by our Night Vision or something) Atropos - cutter of the thread Xaos Entros | |
| | | | PartridgeKing
Sybarite
Posts : 253
Join date : 2011-11-08
| | | | | PartridgeKing
Sybarite
Posts : 253
Join date : 2011-11-08
| | Subject: Moros, Minos & Atropos Sat Feb 07 2015, 13:08 | |
| Progress is being made and two of my Agony Engines near completion, but before the pictures of them I'm not sure if the Moros has ever actually been posted, but as I've had it for a while now I thought I should probably give him some screen time. Firstly a disclaimer, the Moros is not my own creation I saw the model on Ebay and knew it was a perfect counts-as-Talos that then fell into my germinating Agony Engines idea and became the Moros.    And now for the work in progress but nearly completed Agony Engines, and a couple of extra 'teaser' shots. Firstly the Atropos - Termination Engine   Evidence of the continued power of simply turning bits upside-down! And the Minos - Control Engine  I'm going to use the skeletal chest piece once I've painted the bones underneath. The Minos is still missing its arms and having looked at the Morghast model in it's partially built form I've realised that both the wing and arm sockets are potential options, I've ummed and arred and am now leaning towards the wing sockets, however I'd be intrigued to hear other people's thoughts on the arm placement. Option 1 (Wing Socket):  Option 2 (Arm Socket):  Thoughts? And then some pictures of something else I'm working on, technically not an Agony Engine but about the same size, and will be used as such hence the inclusion, I've referenced it before, any guesses?  And a closing shot of the madness that is my work bench!  | |
| | | | Kinnay
Wych
Posts : 626
Join date : 2011-06-06
Location : Hamburg, Germany
| | Subject: Re: Agony Engines Sat Feb 07 2015, 15:45 | |
| Utterly, utterly in love with the Atropos! It's rare indeed to find something you haven't seen on the internet yet, so congratulations! What are the exact parts you've used for it? So I can, uh, appreciate your creativity better? *stolen* | |
| | | | PartridgeKing
Sybarite
Posts : 253
Join date : 2011-11-08
| | Subject: Re: Agony Engines Sat Feb 07 2015, 21:12 | |
| Thankiesai Kinnay, very glad you like it. As for the parts it's surprisingly simple, the body is the Tervigon birthing-sac upside down and back to front, with the little legs of a pair of Canoptek Wraiths and the 'face' plate is one of the shock-gauntlets from a Skaven Stormfiend. I'm intending to add the large 'cheek' mandibles from the Tervigon as the other two points of a triangle pointing towards the lower 'facial blade'. Though the decision is whether or not to continue the lack of symmetry with the placement of those or not. | |
| | | | Rokuro
Wych
Posts : 619
Join date : 2014-11-25
| | Subject: Re: Agony Engines Mon Feb 09 2015, 07:10 | |
| The Atropos looks awesome. Really gives the impression of a huge biomechanical tick.
The Shock Prow for a head gives the Minos a bit of a Pyramid Head vibe. I wouldn't make his arms too big, as that would draw the focus away from the head and torso.
I would be careful with Tyranid bits in general. They do have an alien, yet not unnatural look to them, which can easily end up clashing with the Coven theme of artificality. | |
| | | | PartridgeKing
Sybarite
Posts : 253
Join date : 2011-11-08
| | Subject: Re: Agony Engines Mon Feb 09 2015, 14:33 | |
| @Rokuro thanks, glad you like it, I need to check how it looks with the additional mandibles, but I'm very happy with how the Atropos came out. As for the Minos, I'd not been able to think of what I wanted to use as the head, and that had been my biggest stumbling block for the model for quite some time before I came upon the idea of the Shock Prow, the positioning is wrong for Pyramid Head I know, but being more knife pointed was intended to look more shark-like, whilst maintaining the serpentine aesthetic as well. It works but equally it's a weird amalgamation of what I'd pictured in a fashion I'd not expected, I like it, but not for the reasons I expected to. As for the arms, size is definitely a concern there, which is one of the reasons I'm thinking of using the wing sockets from the Morghasts rather than the arms - though what or whether I'll fill the arm sockets is now a quandry - but the Tervigon/Tyrannofex arms are very large, I'm hoping it will look slightly mismatched but still work without drawing too much from the head - which hadn't seemed to be too much of a concern on intial test placing. You are correct again regarding use of tyranid bits, my Cronos worked mostly because painted as metal it just looks like more worn, oddly shaped armour, but for the Minos I'm not sure whether to play up the biological nature of the arms and make it obviously 'wired-in' almost as if the arms were taken from a tyranid bio-construct, modified to suit the purpose of the Haemonculi and then fused into the very artificial frame of the Minos itself. Alternatively I'm wondering what modifications to the arms I might be able to make to cause them to look more artifically constructed, such as metal plates and mechanisms fused with stitched together arms. Thoughts? Also for anyone, the Deimos will need a lot of it's bulk built up from the back armour plate of the Talos armour pieces that I'm using, now I've got enough green stuff to do this, but the feeling I'm getting is that this wouldn't be the most cost-effective way of building up the fleshey underside before I the add detail ontop of it. Would I be wrong to think that there are better ways to just add bulk, which I can then add greenstuff detail onto later, and can anyone recommend one readily available in the UK / Europe? | |
| | | | PartridgeKing
Sybarite
Posts : 253
Join date : 2011-11-08
| | Subject: Re: Agony Engines Wed Aug 05 2020, 19:13 | |
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