how to get rid of rifleman dreadnoughts?

Yesterday I played a game against space marines in a mini campaign my friends made like planetary empires but is much smaller. I was out numbered but the campaign allows you to exceed the force organisation chart. I packed a razorwing with 2 distingrators and 2 splinter cannons and other related anti marine ap2 and ap3 weapons. My friend used a tactic called the rifleman dreadnought tactic. He used a master of the forge and pack 6 dreadnoughts with 2 twin linked autocannons each. they took short work of my voidraven which i put on anti vehicle and quickly disarmed my anti infantry vehicles with ease. I suffered a crushing defeat only killing 300 pts worth.

So who can tell me a tactic to use agianst spamming dreadnoughts with autocannons. i have thought of putting vect and a trueborn squad (darklight weapons max) on a dais of destruction which is AV13 13 13. anyone else got any ideas?

AV 13 open topped is no solution to massed autocannon fire.
The answer to Dreadnaughts is massed darkmatter weaponry - since they're not GK Dreads you just need to shoot each of them enough to shake/stun them for a turn every turn, eventually you'll win the battle of attrition.

Trueborn with Blasters, Raiders, and Ravagers are your friends, also Warriors w. Blasters.
Also, Haywire gear - Scourges with Haywire Blasters are basically a guarantee of shutting downa dread each turn - even better is 10 Wyches w. Shardnets and Haywire Grenades - charge a couple of dreads, lock them in h2h combat - laugh as he manages to maybe kill 1 Wych a round and grind him out with massed grenades slapped onto his chasis ripping him apart.

Grey Knight psyriflemen are a whole different kettle of fish, but the answer there is, sadly, bring so many dark light weapons it is silly to the point even you are telling yourself you're being cheesy - then bring a couple more and pray you go first and you ought to have a semi-decent chance for the win.

Vehicule squadron : immobilize = destruction.
Never forget that, and darkmmatter, of course.

That's interesting, my answer is Monstrous Creatures!

galimene wrote:

Vehicule squadron : immobilize = destruction.
Never forget that, and darkmmatter, of course.

Only problem with this-each dread is a separate unit.
Agree with Thor-DL, DL, and more DL. Haywire is great for neutralizing shooting threats reliably through shaken results. That being said, that is a scary freeking proposition playing against 12 TL AC's when you roll in cardboard armored open topped skimmers. Yikes.

thanks so much for all the help...i issued a 1500 pt challenge....with proxy...anyone got a army list that i can use?

drop triple talos on him... he only wounds on 4+ and you get a 3+ save... plus hopefully pain tokens later for FNP...

its going to take all 6 dreads shooting 1 talos to take it out on average... and you can run 3 for just a handful of points... drop a WWP and laugh!

Sadly, we live in a mech era this edition. The only true way to beat the mech/tank/AV lists is to either heavily mech up yourself or go the opposite and just use things that the dread would fail to stop.

My thoughts here are talos, alot of wyches, scourges, blasterborn, maybe reavers...just try to outsmart him or outcheese him...if all else fails, just get him stuck in combat and he cant do any harm to you while you tear up everything else.

Also, most of the suggestions that I listed above work very well in a webway list.

Jack_The_Ripper wrote:

Sadly, we live in a mech era this edition. The only true way to beat the mech/tank/AV lists is to either heavily mech up yourself or go the opposite and just use things that the dread would fail to stop.

My thoughts here are talos, alot of wyches, scourges, blasterborn, maybe reavers...just try to outsmart him or outcheese him...if all else fails, just get him stuck in combat and he cant do any harm to you while you tear up everything else.

Also, most of the suggestions that I listed above work very well in a webway list.

+1
Remember: When your opponent does it-it's cheesy. When you do it, it's called tactics.

Wyches with Haywire Grenades work well, a Raider with Enhanced Aethersails to get them closer, quicker. If you engage it, it can't kill enough of them whilst you slowly Haywire Grenade it to death. LAnce weapons to try to pop it, hell, even stunning/shaking it is handy. With GK Riflemen, focus on one until its dead as they ignore shaken and stunned.

edit: Also cheeky positioning, get your Ravagers in a position where you can focus all 6 Lances on one Dreadnought without letting the others see you. My local store has alot of high buildings so its easy for me to pull this stunt (In one 7 turn game, a Tau player only got off 9 shots in the whole game ).

If you're using Wyches, it might be worth noting that it's better to immobilize the Dread first before assaulting.
If you're opponent is using 6 Dreads then I'd go all out Darklight on him. I just took 30 Darklight weapons to a 2250pt tourny and still had room for 7 Venoms, but if you know you are playing 6 Dreads you might want to take 10 more Darklights lol....
It is strange to say but in my opinion your best bet would be a Web Way list. I played a fluffly Web Way list (I mean I took everything you don't want to take if you're trying to win, Harlequins, Mandrakes, Hellions) and got a draw against Grey Knights & they had 3 Psyriflemen Dreads, 35 Terminators, and 2 Strike Squads.
The Harlequins do pretty well against them actually, I don't know if this was luck or what but they Fusion Blaster-ed one of his Dreads in the face & wrecked him. At least with Hit & Run they can't be tied up by a Dread & still get their Invul save.
Talos are a boon against Dreads (I had 2 Talos and one killed two of his Dreads), but try not to fight anything with Force Weapons. With psychic abilities, Grey Knights can be S6 needing 5s to wound, and you haven't even been hit with the hammers yet!

You know, weird idea. How about assaulting them with Mandrakes? They can't do [whatever], yet he also ain't too good in CC.

You can infiltrate close to it, then pop out and...

...and you could do it faster, with more chance to inflict damage, and more chance to survive his attacks, by using Wyches

For a 1500 point list I'd go with
3 Ravagers with 3 DL, 3 units of 3 Blasterborn in raiders, 3 units of 7 wyches with HWG's in raiders. The Baron to get 1st turn.
15 DL's, 9 blasters and 21 HWG's, should just about do it.

Though it's semi off topic:

Let's asume the wyches already took out some units/vehicles and also lost a few of their own.
What would people consider to be the minimum amount of wyches with HWG's (no nets etc) to assault a normal or GK Dread with i.e. cannons+CC arm?

I would say 3-4, all you *really* need is for them to be able to lock him up for a few turns so you can kill everything without having your Raiders popped from under you, any damage on top of that is just cake.

Rabid Bunny wrote:

edit: Also cheeky positioning, get your Ravagers in a position where you can focus all 6 Lances on one Dreadnought without letting the others see you.

x2!!!

This tactic/deployment strategy should be used against ALL armies that bring tanks/heavy fire power. Don't hang your Ravagers out in the open......coz they won't be there the next turn

For 1500 I'd go with 3 Ravagers, 2x 4 Trueborn in Venoms (easier to hide) 2 Wych squads in Raiders with grenades

Oh and OP, if your opponent pulls that whole Dread behind Rhino thing, then you get a coversave unless BOTH BARRELS can see clearly over the top - and if they can, then is he going to be 50% obscured in the return fire.....?

BlckRven wrote:

Though it's semi off topic:

Let's asume the wyches already took out some units/vehicles and also lost a few of their own.
What would people consider to be the minimum amount of wyches with HWG's (no nets etc) to assault a normal or GK Dread with i.e. cannons+CC arm?

Remember too that if the Dread is either Stunned or Immobilised at the start of the Assault phase it losses 1 attack and you're hitting vs WS