Issues with anti horde?

since we are in the tactics page, lets say you were forced to use your wyches to tie them up. Would you go for the smallest footprint? to minimize their swings back?

Guardsmen = O
Wyches = X

OOOOOOO
OOOOOOO
O XXXXX O
__XXXXX

^something like this, your wyches in the back can still swing, but anything past their second line, can't.

Its not that anti-horde is lacking, its that Hordes got really strong with new Wound chart and lack of templates. When i met those new nurglings i was kinda surprised. Too strong for their points. They need some inherent weakness.

Hordes basically needs lots of S6. Everything else is a total waste on them.

Couple of Starweavers with Troops can do some job on them.

When i play my Scitarii, infiltrators clean up hordes. Lots of S3 shooting, lots of S6 close combat. Snipers kills character and morale finish up rest.

Quote :

Hordes basically needs lots of S6.

Scatbikes.

TeenageAngst wrote:

Quote :

Hordes basically needs lots of S6.

Scatbikes.

Uh Uh Uh. Statistically the same number of hits as Shuriken Bikes if they move.
And Scatbikes can't shoot after Advancing.

Shuriken Bikes. But yeah.

Don't move the scatbikes and you mulch hordes. I ate through an entire brimstone horde with them alone.

I can see that working.

How many scatbikes?

They work best as Ynnari with Yvraine popping their soulburst every turn. I run a max squad of 9 and split their fire up as needed, usually with a warlock nearby for that -1 to be hit by return fire.

I'm amazed about this issue. Aren't We dark Eldar? Used to playing warhammer on hard mode? It's not about killing them but rendering them useless. Tie them up with witches or something entirely different but more importantly: kill those officers. And if They are gone, they are nothe that threatening anymore.
And that's the challenge: how do we kill characters? Easiest way would be pathfinder or ranger but they are no true dark Eldar.

I was always confused that DE didn't have an assassin type character. You know, a sharpshooter/melee character killer who could be deployed to take out specific priority targets. If any army should have such a unit, it would be us.

FuelDrop wrote:

I was always confused that DE didn't have an assassin type character. You know, a sharpshooter/melee character killer who could be deployed to take out specific priority targets. If any army should have such a unit, it would be us.

Agreed.

Assassination should be our thing.

TBH, the Archon should have access to a sniper blaster. Or the hexrifle should be D3 dmg.

Quote :

I'm amazed about this issue. Aren't We dark Eldar? Used to playing warhammer on hard mode?

This isn't hard mode. It's gorgonzola mode.

Conscript blobs can 'engulf' and wrap comissars easily, but charging Conscripts from one corner you can to an extent render most of their attacks useless. Also if the opponent wants more hits he has to pile in towards you, in which case the opponent might leave an opening for you.
Also most players try to cover two units with one commissar. They can not move at the same time so if he wants to move commissar he has to leave space for him to move. This space could also be occupied by solitaire/shadowseer/troupe master with right moves and multicharge. Situational? - yes, but doable especially if the blob is already tied in combat.

I am bit unsure how the flyers guns are measured? From base or from hull, if from hull then you could maybe hang a wing over the character and measure closest model from there?

Last option would be to take wracks on Venom or Raider and give them few hexrifles and pray for good rolls, but effectivenes per point is questionable.

One more tricksy option is to give opponent only few routes to fall back, again comissar can not move at the same time, so if you wrap the conscrip blob well you could potentially force him to fall back so long that the comissar is left with relatively bad wrap or even open, if he doesn't take that option even better he is tied in combat for another round.

Painjunky wrote:

FuelDrop wrote:

I was always confused that DE didn't have an assassin type character. You know, a sharpshooter/melee character killer who could be deployed to take out specific priority targets. If any army should have such a unit, it would be us.

Agreed.

Assassination should be our thing.

Something on par with Imperial Assassins as an elites option would be nice. Either two types, one ranged with a badass sniper rifle and the option of double tapping if they don't move, and one melee monster who specializes in killing a single HQ type character quickly and effectively. Or one unit that combines both of those, maybe even a small squad (1-3) who gang up on characters. We are DE, we don't play fair after all!

Even something like the old rules for the Hellion Stunclaw would be superb in 8e, as you grab an important buff character and drag him away from the units he's buffing.

Count Adhemar wrote:

Even something like the old rules for the Hellion Stunclaw would be superb in 8e, as you grab an important buff character and drag him away from the units he's buffing.

Maybe we get dirty tricks Stratagem allowing such a cunning move!

DE assassins? We are raiders and pillagers... hate to say - the evil vikings of W40K. Where did you read we have any special assassins? I believe that is fantasy prejudice speaking. IMO no basis for it in W40K. But I can be wrong and will happily accept if someone can point me to some reference.

aurynn wrote:

DE assassins? We are raiders and pillagers... hate to say - the evil vikings of W40K. Where did you read we have any special assassins? I believe that is fantasy prejudice speaking. IMO no basis for it in W40K. But I can be wrong and will happily accept if someone can point me to some reference.

I figure in a society of feuding elites such as the Dark Eldar, individuals with skills at assassinating political rivals and threats covertly are a natural fit. I find your views on the Dark Eldar very interesting by the way.

Mandrakes alone are already supposed to be assassins. The whole "upset the Archon and you'll end up struggled by our own shadow" feels very assassinesque (because that's totally a word) to me.
So it could be nice to have the sniper rule on mandrakes...

Mandrakes hired to kill, archons having to stave of assasins from everyone all the time:

Though every Archon is a conceited, solipsistic megalomaniac convinced of his mental and physical superiority over all other beings, he will retain his position as an overlord of Commorragh for only as long as he can stave off the endless coup and assassination attempts of his rivals, enemies and his own Dracon lieutenants.

Seems like we use assasins very often since our archons have to stave of endless assasination attempts.

FuelDrop wrote:

aurynn wrote:

DE assassins? We are raiders and pillagers... hate to say - the evil vikings of W40K. Where did you read we have any special assassins? I believe that is fantasy prejudice speaking. IMO no basis for it in W40K. But I can be wrong and will happily accept if someone can point me to some reference.

I figure in a society of feuding elites such as the Dark Eldar, individuals with skills at assassinating political rivals and threats covertly are a natural fit. I find your views on the Dark Eldar very interesting by the way.

Thank you. And I like if people challenge those views of mine with their own like you do. Its enriching. :-)

Yea. It does sound like a natural thing, but I think they are beyond that. There are no snipers shooting Archons through open windows... they usually make their tricks much more sinister. Betrayals and traps and such...

That I agree with. I would much rather see an melee variant then a normal sniper.
But that does not mean we should not get an assasin like option. Something that has a way of targetting enemy characters despite blobs surrounding them.

Why not just take Solitaire? He is an assassin alright. S5 -2, lots of atacks, crazy good movement, can hop through units. The very definition of assassin. Dont like the estetics - convert him.

He is practically Altair of 40k, looking just like him and probably entire model estetic has been taken from Assassin Creed.

I like the idea of mandrakes striking from shadows... Would not solve anything probably though since they would need to fit  and smart player wont let even single model fit near his critical character. Shooting with option to target characters is the only reliable way of hitting a character. We will have to get used to that we cannot remove a force multiplier character of an army that is reliant on it. Although it makes snipers somewhat meh...

Solitaire is certainly great in that role. But again - he has to fit near his target...