1500 Vs Space Wolves

Facing off against a new Space Wolves player, who seems to lead with some powerful IC with psyc shooting attack, using tanks for backup. I don't know what his list will be.

This is what I'm looking at going with: 1497points

Lady Malys
Haemy w/ stinger pistol, flesh gauntlet, soul trap, and crucible of malediction
5x Wyches w/haywires
Raider w/torment grenade launcher

5x Wyches w/haywires
Raider

5x Wyches w/haywires
Raider

5x Wracks w/liquifier

5x Wracks w/liquifier

10x Kabalites w/blaster, splinter cannon
Raider w/splinter racks

5x Scourge w/heat lance, blaster

Ravager w/night shields, flickerfield

Talos w/chain flails, stinger pod

Razorwing w/shatterfields, splinter cannon, night shields


What do you all think...am I just nuts?

My plan is to use his aggressive use of psyc HQ against him by going flat out 30" first turn then use Lady Malys as psyc protection to the unit, then use Haemy to challenge him if the crucible of malediction (assisted by torments) fails to remove him...thereby picking up double strength from the soul trap.

I'm not fond of Talos without webway, however in my last couple games it has drawn lots of fire and lasted longer than any Ravager would. So if he focuses on that, I gain freedom from my other units, and if not..then it can still do some damage with Lady Malys allowing me to re-deploy him if needed.

I'd be tempted to put torment grenade launchers on all the raiders and the Ravager if you're using the crucible along with them. Modifying his leadership by one isn't going to be that amazing. Whether or not you can safely get all those vehicles that close is another matter entirely, but with a one shot piece of wargear like that, it might be better to increase your chances. I tried it once. It's risky. If it had worked though, it would have been amazing!

If the IC is Njal Stormcaller, which from the sounds of it, it could be, STAY AWAY FROM HIM. Use cover to minimise the damage from Living Lightning and concentrate on the other parts of his army. Njal's nastiest trick (as I found out to the cost of a Succubus, three wyches and a Haemonculus recently) isn't his powers - it's his end of turn hissy fit. A dice is rolled, added to the turn number, then you consult the table. On one of them, he whips up storms for 18" around him, inflicting D6 S8 hits on units within 18" and in line of sight. It's horrendous. Just hang back with the Venoms and mass splinter fire on him. In fact, best to stay back generally - a lot of Space Wolf stuff is designed for monstrous creature or independent character killing, so there are various ways they can reduce your initiative before they charge you. And if you charge them, they have counter-attack. Stay at maximum range and whittle them down, as one thing your list doesn't have is specialised combat units. Your plan to challenge him with the haemonculus might not go down wonderfully well - if it's a standard rune priest, maybe, but Njal has Runic Terminator armour, so 2+ armour, 4+ invulnerable (I think). Hitting on 4s, wounding and insta-killing on 4s... You might get lucky, but I'd think it was risky even against the standard Rune priest. Haemonculi aren't combat characters, so gambling on them taking out Space Wolf HQs might not pay off. The flesh gauntlet/soul trap combo makes him rather expensive too, and if you're intending to use him for the crucible and anti-psker nastiness, it might be better to save the points and have him just for that.

I fielded the Razorwing against my friends Space Wolves yesterday - I'd normally give it Shatterfields, but couldn't justify the 20 points I'd be spending to do it just for one extra strength and no AP. Now that missiles damage vehicles at full strength as long as part of the template is over them, the standard Monoscythes are better than they were, and still wounding on 2s. Also, if he brings Fenrisian Wolves, at least you'll bypass the armour of something. I also gave it disintegrator cannons, but that was because I knew for sure that I'd be facing Terminators. I reasoned that when I did get the Razorwing lined up, it'd be easier to target squads than vehicles, and as you can only fire two missiles maximum per turn, which on the Razorwing are anti-infantry, it made sense to swap the two dark lance shots for six disintegrator ones.

Talos... yes. When I use mine, it attracts an absolute ton of fire, because people know that if it gets there, it's going to wreck their tank. I often find everything shoots at it for as long as it takes to die, target prioritisation going completely out the window as your opponent panics at the big evil beetle humming towards them.

I can't comment on Lady Malys, as I don't use her, but she seems like a solid choice now that psykers are all over the place.

I usually give Scourges haywire blasters, as the extra range they have over blasters and especially heat lances means they can pop out from behind something, fire off a couple of shots and then pop back into cover next turn without having to get to close. Obviously a couple of glancing hits no longer stop a vehicle shooting now, but they'll strip of hull points more reliably than the other options, and you've got wyches for the rest.

Thanks for the great info! Yes, I remember living lightning being talked about when he was playing another game. I've played mostly assault...so this will give me an opportunity to work out how to use gunboats while keeping the wracks hidden behind objectives to capture those points.

I've re-tooled the list with your response in mind, keeping Lady Malys for psyc protection with Haemy taking a hexrifle, and a unit of Trueborn in Venom with cannons, should lay out 24 poisoned shots at 36"...seems like that could be pretty good.

I've taken disintegrator cannon's on everything - would it be better to split that in some way and still take some DL's?


1500 Pts even

HQ: Lady Malys
1 Haemonculus, (Hexrifle x1)
3 Kabalite Trueborn, 140 pts (Splinter Cannon x2; Plasma Grenades; Haywire Grenades)
1 Venom (Splinter Cannons (x2); Flickerfield; Night Shields)

Troops: Kabalite Warriors
10 Kabalite Warriors, (Blaster x1; Splinter Cannon x1)
1 Raider (Disintegrator Cannon x1; Splinter Racks)

Troops: Wyches
5 Wyches, Haywire Grenades)
1 Raider Disintegrator Cannon x1

Troops: Wyches
5 Wyches, Haywire Grenades)
1 Raider Disintegrator Cannon x1

Troops: Wyches
5 Wyches, Haywire Grenades)
1 Raider Disintegrator Cannon x1

Troops: Wracks
4 Wracks, 40 pts
Troops: Wracks
5 Wracks, Liquifier Gun x1

Heavy Support: Talos Pain Engine
1 Talos Pain Engine; TL Liquifier Gun; TL Haywire Blaster)

Heavy Support: Razorwing Jetfighter
1 Razorwing Jetfighter; Monoscythe Missile x4; Disintegrator Cannon x2; Splinter Cannon x1)

Heavy Support: Ravager
1 Ravager, Assault; Disintegrator Cannon x3; Night Shields; Flickerfield)

Fast Attack: Scourges
5 Scourges, Shardcarbine x3; Ghostplate Armour; Plasma Grenades; Haywire Blaster x2)

I like it, it looks nice and shooty - maybe keep lances on the Raiders, as five wyches won't definitely wreck a vehicle, and it's nice to have a bit more insurance. Also, sniper rifles are brilliant fun now, I've been considering using a hexrifle on a haemonculus too... but now I have Pathfinders

Game over, with DE emerging victorious.

Start of game couldn't have gone better for me: Night fighting to start, I won first turn and was able to re-deploy Talos for a straight shot on run at the Wolf Guard.

Mission was Relic and Dawn of War deployment.

His list:
HQ:
Logan Grimnar
Njal Stormcaller

Troops:
2 units of Grey Hunters
2 units of Wolf Guard with termmie armor

Heavy Support:
1 unit of Long Fangs


Turn 1:
Ravager dropped 9 desi shots on the 4 long fangs atop a building, missed one and wiped the unit. Raiders shot up and missed lots of shots on the Wolf Guard while the Wracks ran for the relic (not a single run roll above 2). Venom w/trueborne dropped 24 splinter shots on Wolf Guard and did nothing, 1 Hexrifle shot got through.

He immobilized a Raider, put 1 wound on Talos, killed 3 Wracks and 1 Scourge.

Turn 2:
Razorwing arrived and wiped out a unit of Wolf Guard, Wracks move closer to the Relic with a unit of Wyches from the immobile Raider closing in from the other side. Scourges go on suicide run to assault Njal in hopes to negate his shooting abilities. Njal takes one wound, Scourges save 3. Raiders all converge on the Relic, aiming at the Grey Hunters.

His unit of Grey Hunters failed to come in from reserves due to my -1 modifier on his reserves roll due to warlord trait. He moved into base contact with the Relic and shot up my 5 Wyches coming in for the Relic with bolters...they died. Talos takes 2 wounds and dies from remaining Wolf Guard unit.

Turn 3:
Razorwing moves 24" (yay for sharp angle entry) and drops the Wolf Guard. Wracks make it to the Relic and face off against the Grey Hunters, all remaining Raiders and Venom fire at Grey Hunters (1 Hexrifle, 9 Desi, 39 splinter shots)
He scooped the game before the shots were rolled.


Thanks for the advise Mr. Believer!

He scooped the game?

He quit?

You really seemed to have more models than him. Which performed best and which performed the least?

Grumpy Kwi wrote:

He scooped the game?

He quit?

Yes, he conceded the game. I already had 2 victory points (for first blood and linebreaker) and I was moments away from shooting his squad to death and then taking the Relic (for 3 more victory points).

He spent a LOT on his two HQ's, over 550 points, basically left him taking a 1000 point list against my 1500 point list.

Grumpy Kwi wrote:

You really seemed to have more models than him. Which performed best and which performed the least?

Yes, I had 8 units and 3 Heavy vs his 4 units and 1 Heavy.

I was really impressed by how the Scourges held up. 4 of them stayed locked in combat with Njal for three rounds of assault before dying (two of those assaults had Logan Grimnar as well). They just kept making their saves....but tied up those two so they couldn't do anything else.

Lady Malys with Haemy and three Trueborn with 2x Splinter Cannons in Venom performed very well! It negated Njal's ability to target the unit with his unlimited range psyker shooting attack. Allowing me to stay around 30 - 33" from units and lay down 24 splinter shots and 1 hexrifle per turn.

Taking units of 5 forced hard shooting choices, because not everything could be shot at...it allowed me some freedom that I wouldn't have had otherwise. I'll be doing that again.

StaticVortex wrote:

Thanks for the advise Mr. Believer!

No problem! Night fighting on the first turn was good for you, obviously - I got it on the warlord traits table in my last game, also versus Space Wolves. I also went straight for the Long Fangs! And the Razorwing is so much fun, even more than it used to be...

Well done on the win!