Adepticon 2017

Great idea.
I had a last second change of heart about my army, still going with DE but added allies.
NOT YANNARI though. I may be forced to change sooner or later, but for now I am just banking on most of my opponents not knowing how to play them correctly.

Care to share what you're bringing? I don't blame you if you don't. I'm not, haha.

I will probably share my list on the day of the tournament, or after the tournament is over, depending on how hectic game day is.

I'm actually far less comfortable with this list than I have been with any tournament list I've ever fielded, so I may end up doing worse than I have in the past. There are very specific reasons for this that I currently have no solution for due to the composition of my list. It'll be easier to understand once I release my list details. Suffice to say that I don't have the amount of redundancy that I normally like to have in my lists. My list has a very high upside when things go right, but there is the potential for things to go wrong, and I normally don't like to leave potential for things to go wrong.

Those attending will be able to see my list earlier than everyone else though!

I dont care if people know what i am bringing, in this case it is not top tier, but I have some surprises for war con and yannari all lined up..

You know just realized, 3 wyverns would mess up almost any yannari's list day!

Not going but I'm curious what lists people are running after the event.

Skulnbonz wrote:

I dont care if people know what i am bringing, in this case it is not top tier, but I have some surprises for war con and yannari all lined up..

You know just realized, 3 wyverns would mess up almost any yannari's list day!

Yeah, it'd be pretty good against most Ynnari lists. That's why I'm with you in thinking that playing atypically is probably going to win the day. My list is designed against the grain, because I expect good players to be playing to counter Ynnari, while many weak players will be playing the basic Ynarri scatbike/warp spider spam being touted on the internet. Mix that with the typical meta we've seen for the last year or so, and you should have a pretty good idea of what to prepare for.

Like I said, I actually think the list I've designed for this adepticon has the most potential for failure of any list I've ever taken to a tournament, which is sort of exciting in its own way. I don't normally leave much to chance, so having a higher risk of failure is somewhat interesting for me. Though, I'm still trying to work out a way to further minimize my risk. I just haven't come up with anything yet.

Scatbikes and Warp Spiders are still king, but the way you use them now is entirely different from the way a traditional CWE list would use them.

TeenageAngst wrote:

Scatbikes and Warp Spiders are still king, but the way you use them now is entirely different from the way a traditional CWE list would use them.

I know what your opinion is on this. I don't know why you continue to tell me what it is, despite the fact that you know I'm not going to agree with you, haha. I basically just said 80% of the internet is going to think X and Y is best, but I don't agree. Then you come in and say you agree with the 80%. I know you do. I almost just mentioned you in the first comment about it, just so you'd know I knew your position, but I felt like mentioning you would be inviting you to mention it again, so I refrained.

Damned if I do. Damned if I don't.

My opinion is not that they're king, but that they're simply the most obvious ways to exploit the army rules. The most obvious ways to use something aren't always the "best"(oftentimes, precisely BECAUSE they're the most obvious), and I generally think of something that is "the king" as being equal to "the best". And "the best" shifts with subtle variables and game dynamics that extend beyond pure math, such as, how units interact with what the majority of other players are going to be playing.

Example: Let's assume scatterbikes are the mathematically best unit in the game. We know that against any random opponent, scatterbikes have the highest chance of being the most effective unit. If 99 out of 100 people play a bunch of scatterbikes, and 1 guy plays the mathematically inferior unit that just so happens to be an effective counter to scatterbikes, the latter guy wins despite using mathematically inferior units because his list was tailored to the meta, not to the brute force "best unit".

Kid lemme tell you something. I have played these spiders and scatbikes against some darn good players and if there's one thing I know it's how effective they are when used in abnormal ways. Defensive "oh I'm gonna turtle" kinda CWE plays are gonna lose left right and center as CWE. Yes scatbikes and spiders are best. No, the way most people use them is not. If you face some loser playing Ynnari as CWE yes you're gonna win especially if you go counter meta. But if you play like I do you're gonna run those units like you stole them and get the absolute most mileage out of them.

The #1 thing you can bring to the table, above strategy, above a plan, is a surprise. Play normal units in an abnormal way and you have a surprise. Make your opponent think they know what you got, then show them otherwise. That's victory.

So basically, you're saying...

Be flexible, where your opponent thinks you are rigid.
Be strong, where your opponent thinks you are weak.
Know thyself, and know thy opponent, and you will never know defeat.

Ok Sun Tzu.

Oh, but wait, earlier you agreed that the Yncarne was best used against bad players, and that almost everyone you play are bad players, but just now you said you played these against darn good players...and within the past month or so, you posted about playing Eldar thinking it was going to be an easy victory because "OMG ELDAR SO OP" and you got stomped instead.

Do multiple people post using your account name? That would explain a lot.

My meta is weird. Sometimes I play god awful people, sometimes I play top shelf players. It depends who decides to commute to my hobby shop. Such is living in the NOBA circuit. Also I had all of 4 practice games with Eldar when I entered that GT and my opponents were Josh Kinder, Matt Schuchman, another person playing a mirror list of mine, and 2 people I stomped. I don't feel bad losing to people who wreck players like cash 4 clunkers wrecked perfectly good cars.

I'm sorry, it seems like there is a lot more text there, but all I can make out is: "Excuses, excuses."

Maybe it's my eyes. I AM getting old.

Big talk for a guy who don't even post his lists. You already know mine, let's see what kinda mojo YOU'RE cooking kid.

TeenageAngst wrote:

Big talk for a guy who don't even post his lists. You already know mine, let's see what kinda mojo YOU'RE cooking kid.

There are plenty of my lists on here. Just very old ones. There are also TONS of "my lists" that I've made for people based on models they own or list ideas they had. Just because I don't post the ones I personally play at large GTs doesn't mean I don't post lists.

WildCandy actually just got 3rd place in a decently sized tournament using a list I helped him build on here, and while 100% of the credit for winning goes to him as the (very astute)player, saying I don't post my competitive list ideas at all isn't entirely accurate. I just don't post them in my own threads.

I've also basically adopted a policy of not replying to army list ideas people have unless they specifically ask for my advice by name, because when I do, I put a lot of time and effort into listbuilding, and some people take offense when I indicate that their idea isn't the best and offer them a solution. Occasionally I'll see a list idea that piques my interest, and I might voluntarily say something, but that's the exception to the rule these days.

That said, I've already said in this very thread that I'll release my list either on gameday, or after adepticon depending on time constraints.

When I pry my face off this porcelain throne and get myself right with god I'm gonna... idk... probably say something witty I guess...

I wish Shining Spears were good so I could take those instead of scatbikes.

TeenageAngst wrote:

When I pry my face off this porcelain throne and get myself right with god I'm gonna... idk... probably say something witty I guess...

I'll be right here holding my breath in anticipation.

I was just practicing last night. Everyone knows the drunker you are the better you play. Just ask the Wobbly Modelers.

Well, At Adepticon, I am playing to win in the team event, and do well in the GT. Ah, who am I kidding, I play to win no matter what.
I know I will be close or make the finals, unless my sub-par list really sucks it up, but like Betray, I feel the net listers will be so prevalent they wont have a clue what hit them. My army has longer range, and plays against yannaris basic need of huddling close together.

They can beat me if they spread out, but too many players will be too greedy and want the souldburst. Always play to the mission, not to kill units. That is the hardest 40K lesson to adhere to, and yannari is not obsec.

Looking forward to it, and meeting other Dark City members!

That does sound like a good counter. Wyvern spam and the like are solid counters to Ynnari in all its many flavors. Also why do I call people "kid" when I'm 3 sheets?

I guess besides playing better, you also progress in age when you drink. After 4 crown and cokes, you would even call the elderly "Kid"

Skulnbonz wrote:

They can beat me if they spread out, but too many players will be too greedy and want the souldburst.  Always play to the mission, not to kill units. That is the hardest 40K lesson to adhere to, and yannari is not obsec.

Indeed, which is one of those things I find it so odd that people forget. I mean, yes you win max points if you table the opponent, but that isn't always easy to build against all comers for. Much easier to build a list that can handle all comers and win by grabbing objectives, IMO.

Has anyone seen a rule that forbids "Come the Apocalypse" allies at adepticon? I had thought I saw it before, but I'm having trouble finding anything that says it isn't allowed. @Skulnbonz ?

I can't find it either! I thought they had that as a rule, but maybe they changed that when they changed all the rules mid-stream..

What is this, the LVO?

Ok, here is my adepticon list. I don't have time to go into strategy till later. Feel free to speculate in the meantime!

Reborn Warhost 1:
1 Farseer w/ Singing spear
1 Warlock
1x3 Windrider Jetbikes w/Scatter lasers
1x5 Rangers
1 Wraithknight w/wraithcannons and 1 scatter laser
Seer Council:
2x1 Farseer w/ Singing spear
1x5 Warlock Conclave w/4 Singing Spears
Reborn Warhost 2:
1 Baharroth
1 Archon w/Jetbike, Banshee mask, & Laster Lance
1x3 Windrider Jetbikes w/ Scatter lasers
1x5 Rangers
1x1 Shadowseer w/Mask of Secrets, ML2
1x1 Vaul's Wrath Support Battery(Shadow Weaver)
1 Wraithknight w/wraithcannons and 1 scatter laser