New to DE: 2000 point list

Hey,

I've just started dark eldar and have planned a 2000 point army, feedback would be great for this inexperienced player!

HQ:
Archon w/ agoniser, shadowfield, webway portal - 145 points

Haemonculus Ancient w/ flesh gauntlet, soul trap, hex rifle - 125 points

Elites:
4 Incubi w/ klaivex, venom, night shields - 168 points

8 Mandrakes w/ nightfiend - 130 points

3 Kabalite Trueborn w/ 2x splinter cannon - 56 points

Troops:
10 Kabalite Warriors w/ dark lance, sybarite - 125 points

10 Wyches w/ razorflails, shardnet and impaler, hekatrix, agoniser, blast pistol - 165 points

10 Wyches w/ razorflails, shardnet and impaler, hekatrix, agoniser - 150 points

9 Wracks w/ liquifier gun, acothyst, scissorhand, raider, night shields, flickerfield - 205 points

Fast Attack:
15 Hellions w/ helliarch, agoniser - 265 points

6 Reavers w/ blaster, cluster caltrops - 167 points

Heavy Support:
Cronos Parasite Engine w/ spirit probe, spirit vortex - 110 points

Razorwing Jetfighter w/ 4x necrotoxin missiles, nightshields, flickerfield - 185 points

The plan: The mandrakes, both wych squads, hellions and cronos are in reserve. The trueborn and warriors camp in terrain, preferably a high building with a good view. The archon accompanies the incubi in the venom and is going to attempt to zoom into the enemy army and plant the webway portal. The haemonculus accompanies the wracks in the raider and is the independant character hunter. The reavers look for the weak flank, while the razorwing can either tank hunt or slay troops en masse.

So, in theory it sounds good (to me anyway!), but what do you think?

Thanks,

Baron Judas

Hi! Welcome to the forum! Looking at your list and reasoning, I would say that you are not using some units in their optimal roles. I'll go unit-by-unit. If I don't mention a certain aspect, it's good to go in my book.

Archon/Haemonculus
Oh my. You have reversed these two from their traditional usage! The Archon, with a 2+ invulnerable save and great stats to use Huskblade+Soul Trap, is the independent character hunter of the codex. Meanwhile, the Haemonculus, which can be equipped very cheaply, makes a great Webway Portal carrier. A typical Webway setup would be 2 Haemonculi with Portals and Liquifiers. Giving it more equipment usually means you lose more equipment as your enemy shoots up the Portal carrier squad that just zoomed into his face.

Baron Sathonyx should be a consideration in any list with Hellions- his value includes going first (big for a Webway list), Stealth (big for a big fat Hellion blob), and Grenades (for the Hellions or even the Incubi!).

Incubi
Good unit setup, poor role again! They really want to be able to pick their close combat battles, and not be put on Webway Portal duty. The starting units carrying the portals tend to take massive fire, and the relatively expensive Incubi would suffer needlessly when there are perfectly good Wracks around to do the job. Additionally, if the Archon is with them, give the Archon a Phantasm Grenade Launcher- grenades are pretty clutch.

Mandrakes
You will be told to drop this unit, and why, in great detail. For myself, I doubt they will serve you well.

Trueborn
You have a lot of anti-infantry already, and Trueborn can be very efficient anti-tank. Since you want them in the backfield, I recommend "Lanceborn", 86 points, 2 Dark Lances. Not bad.

Warriors
If you need points elsewhere, trim the Sybarite. The Ld 9 isn't needed.

Wyches
These need Haywire Grenades. Accept no substitutes. You will use them and love them. Additionally, since there are 10 in each squad, they each could take an extra Shardnet. The Blast Pistol would be the first thing to cut.

Wracks
A big fat unit is neat, but if you do decide to use Wracks for your Webway Portal carrier(s), small units all the way. As few as 3 Wracks can get the job done. Now, this isn't saying you couldn't run a big unit of footslogging Wracks to come out of a Webway Portal as well, and they could be a terror to inflict on an enemy's objectives.

Hellions
The Baron makes these guys Troops. A really nice bonus!

Reavers
With 6, they can take 2 Blasters. As you have the slots, two units of 3 is nice to split them up. You shouldn't be concerned with Kill Points in most games.

Heavy Support
I know next-to-nothin about the Chronos. I do know a Talos gets you more anti-tank, which the list still wants even after adding the haywire Grenades.

Razorwing
I love the Razorwing, but it needs that anti-tank support much of the time. I'm not sure if this needs to be a Ravager, but I will say the Razorwing does better as focused anti-infantry and forgets that it can take Dark Lances- getting off one big missile+Disintegrators strike, then picking off weakened squads for as long as it can. This may just need to be a Ravager for the 3 Dark Lances, though.


The list is diverse, but it needs a little re-arranging. Think about the anti-tank, anti-transport, anti-"entire enemy army is mechanized" question. Haywire Wyches are a good start, but at 2000 points, you'll have a lot of mech to conquer. I'm sure others will have good suggestions as well. Enjoy the DE!

CaptainBalroga wrote:

Mandrakes
You will be told to drop this unit, and why, in great detail. For myself, I doubt they will serve you well.

Hehehe... Mandrakes. Seeing as you beat me to it, I won't rant about them.

Welcome to Commorragh, Baron_Judas.

I have to agree with CaptainBalgora. You have a good list, but you aren't utilising them to their full ability.
You should really be using the Archon and his Incubi for IC hunting, and leave the Haemonculous for more fun duties.

I do like your list, but I have not tried the Cronos Parasite Engine. If it works for you then please let me know.
I think that you should throw a couple of Ravagers in, however, and drop the Razorwing.
Although the Razorwing is pretty awesome, especially the model, Ravagers are so much cheaper and you need the extra AT in your army.
This could also be used well with haveing Haywire Grenades with your Wyches. You could, however, have Heat Lances on your Reavers. This would be another useful upgrade.

Enjoy your experience with the DEldar. They are fun, fast and good at starting a massacre.
Have fun!

Wow, okay, thankyou CaptainBalroga and Cavash!

My aim was to be rather diverse, I'm not too bothered about a 'competitive' list, but will take on a few pointers.

So,

Archon/Haemonculus
I see your point, but would this role reversal not work? I guess I could try it both ways, though I'll take it from you experienced folks that your way works best!

As for the Baron, yes, I have seriously considered him, and I do love hellions, may convert one up at some point and give a go.

Incubi
Again, I see what you mean, so I guess it'll be up to trial and error.

Mandrakes
Well, I was highly recommended these by my DE playing friend, so may have gone and bought some already (I also love the models). I'll give them a go, though from all the bad rep, I'm not expecting much.

Trueborn
Fair enough, I've fought one of my Ork friends who uses like 90+ boyz, so the more dakka the merrier was my reasoning.

Warriors
Sure, it was force of habit to add a group leader.

Wyches
Again, I don't face much in the way of vehicles, but i shall see what I can do.

Wracks
I like wracks... Well, I guess I'll see if my whole role reversal works, if not, I'll take on that advice!

Razorwing
Again, I love the razorwing and amn't bothered about competitiveness. I might try out ravagers at some point, but not initially.

Well, I already have a cronos and an archon, and I've just ordered a battleforce, 5 hellions, 5 incubi, 5 mandrakes, succubus and a venom. Starting smallish and working my way up.

Thanks for all the advice!

Baron Judas

Ooh, I know that you said you're not playing competitively, but if you want your Ork playing friend to cry then I would recomend the Duke with nine trueborn, 2 Splinter Cannons and seven Shardcarbines. This is 33 3+ poisoned shots. It is rather nice against horde armies, but so are Liquifiers from what I have heard.

Just be sure that if you get to make your list to beat your Ork friend, he gets a fair shot to make a list to beat you!

It looks like you have the right idea: try things out and see what works for your playstyle and favored enemy. The strength of the codex comes from the majority of the units being playable when your army supports itself- just like with Craftworld Eldar, but with more ability to recover when a unit gets blown up.

Don't worry, I'm not tailoring a list to be suited to him in particular. I just trust number of shots over quality.

But thanks again, I'll be sure to try out my options and then come crawling back when (no doubt) my dastardly plans go to pot.

Out of interest, i am aware of the animosity shown towards mandrakes, what about harlequins? Are they treated by the dark eldar community with equal contempt?

Thanks,
Baron Judas

Harlequins make excellent Webway delivery guys -- their Veil of Tears works quite well with an Archon or Haemi attached, carrying the WWP.

The problem with harlies (and don't get me wrong, I do agree that they are amazing!) is that they have a low ++ save, and no option for FNP. They are excellent at getting across a battlefield intact, but don't expect them to survive a lengthy amount of time afterward. That being said: I have run them once, and I did earn my points back with them, as I assaulted a battlewagon (which exploded and left me with 5, half my squad), got shot down to 1 man, who then proceded to fusion pisol a looted wagon and explode it. They aren't bad by any means, just more frail than I would like...