1850 points, very comptetitive list vs ETC players lists.

Hi guys,  oh boy I need your help on this!

I am playing a tournament this Saturday, full of ETC players and very competaitive lists. Wave Spam, Screamers stars, Centurions stars, Tau missile spam... you name it.

I am going to play a  DE & E allies list. ETC restrictions.

the list:

Succubus, HG, Haywire, WWP, HoS. (joins the Fire Dragons and works as delivery guide and then continues alone to hunt Psykers).

Archon, Blaster, WWP (joins trueborn and Autarch and works as delivery guide as well)

5 trueborn, 3 blasters, Raider, DL, NS

4 x 5 warriors + Venoms with 2 Cannons

Raider, DL, NS  (Fire Dragons and Succubus ride)

2 x Razonwings with DL

Ravenger

Eldar Allies

Autarch with fusion gun

3 x Windriders

5 x Fire Dragons with Exarch and Fast shot (join Succubus in Raider)

Wraithknight

Total: 1846,   one more point and I could give the Archon haywire granades as well. :-(

The list has a powerful second turn where the 2 WWP units and flyers hopefully come in (on a 2+) and save the day. I like the idea of being able to fire at multiple targets. The Archon and Autarch can disembark from the Raiders after delivery and target something other than the trueborn can. Their Raiders DL can do the same thing. The Dragon warriors can disembark and do the same, their Raider can shoot at some else and even the succubus can trow a grenade and assault something third. The flyers can take care of hordes and stars (with help from one of the two WWP units). The list gives me many possibilities and uses.

With little luck I could disable 3-4 or even 5 Wave serpents. Deathstars can be dealed with. Tau wont be able to intercept everything. So I think I have my bases covered but I need your input.

Please C & C as you feel like.

Do you think the WWP for the Trueborn is necessary? Because you can disembark 6'' and still have the 18'' range, you should never be out of range with them. Plus you can get quite a bit for those 35pts.

I would probably throw some Cannons on the Razorwings for FMCs which have been wonderful for me. A Haywire Grenade on the Archon would be too bad as it is more reliable than the Blaster, but is useless vs non-mech units. If you do not want the Haywire Grenade, throw a 4th Blaster on the Trueborn to give an additional shot for that unit.

With the Fire Dragons, do you find having Fast Shot on the Exarch is worth an additional Fire Dragon? You have 4 pts left over and the Exarch + Fast Shot upgrade is 20pts, you can add in another whole Fire Dragon for the Points. Or do you find that the extra BS 5 shot is better than the extra body? I would think the extra body adds in more surviviability and if you get into CC more attacks and an additional Melta Bomb.

Overall I do feel the list is strong overall.

Thank you for your comments.

The WWP on the trueborn is there to provide access to rear armour. Otherwise a ravenger would have been better (better range) and cheaper.

I can't see how giving a 4th blaster to the trueborn unit would give me more points.

I like the idea of cannons on the Razorwings.

Good call about the Exarch and thte extra Fire Dragon. But I think the extra shot on a 2+ is better that an extra wound and extra melta.

I would lose the ns as both raiders will be shot at with enough firepower that a 3+ will not help. I would also take off helm of spite. It is good but your succubus will get killed as soon as they know what it does.

Those should allow you to add another bike squad for obsec denial. Or if you can add another formation
Lose the 2 kabolite squads to add in the scalpel squadron for null deployment. Then have everything else reserve. Go second and laugh.

Should have been more clear. You could get the Blaster and Cannons by dropping the other Portal for the Trueborn.

thank you guys.

So out with the 2 NS. Thats 30 points.

I cant get a formation since that eould be a third source/detachment and only two are allowed.

So no Scalpel :-(

I like the helmet and I have had great succes with it so I'd like it to stay.

Maybe I have too much AT and need more venoms ? What if I took the Ravenger out and got two Venoms ?

No because to do that you would lose obsec. And I think yo need that more. Also first turn dl shots still help.

Other than that use the 30 for sc on the razorwings then add in the hwg to the archon you should be good.

Remember to reserve the ravanger if needed to keep it alive when facing drop pods or imp guard.

koshi482 wrote:

No because to do that you would lose obsec. And I think yo need that more. Also first turn dl shots still help.

Other than that use the 30 for sc on the razorwings then add in the hwg to the archon you should be good.

Remember to reserve the ravanger if needed to keep it alive when facing drop pods or imp guard.

good idea to 'save' the Ravenger when facing drop pods and imp guard.

What do you suggest to deploy for the first turn vs 1. Tau/ Eldar,   2. SM/AM.   3. GK/knights?

So to summarize: off with the 2 NS and in with 2 cannons on the flyers and Haywire on the Archon.

That gives me 9 points left. Hmmm...

Can autarch get hwg? Could be buddies latter charging vehicles

Tau u out range so should get first shot. Depends on list. Eldar either reserve or use it to hit/deny a flank. To counter when other reserves come in.

SM not a lot of ignore cover so use it to advantage

Gk you out range by margines. Use it to force him to use shunt 30 inch move early

Autarch comes base with Haywire so thats good.

Remember if you ever have 3 pts or more left and have an Autarch, throw a Scorpion Chainsword on him for the +1 str. AP 6 CC weapon.

Is the Succusbus armed with Hydra Gauntlets? If so, I would definitely try and get the Glaive on her and find the points for it.

You could change Succubus for second Archon and trade Ravager for two HQ Venoms.

Overal I cannot comment a lot on your list as mine is quite a lot different from yours. But in general all upgrades must bu justified. Exarch must go and raider transports should be 20pts cheaper. Also lone psykers are next to nonexcists in ETC meta, so the Succubus idea is wasted. The one exception being mantle seer is too fast to chatch with footslogging models.

Vasara wrote:

You could change Succubus for second Archon and trade Ravager for two HQ Venoms.

Overal I cannot comment a lot on your list as mine is quite a lot different from yours. But in general all upgrades must bu justified. Exarch must go and raider transports should be 20pts cheaper. Also lone psykers are next to nonexcists in ETC meta, so the Succubus idea is wasted. The one exception being mantle seer is too fast to chatch with footslogging models.

Excellent!! thank you.

Succubus out! second archon in! 2 venoms instead of Ravager?? Ok.

No NS on raiders. Cannons on the flyers. HWG on both archons (blasters too),

Does the Exarch need to go? I really like the idea of 2 2+ to hit melta shots. Even though its only 3 poins cheaper than an extra Fire Dragon.

Ok, so after many changes I end up with this:

HQ1: Archon, blaster, HWG, WWP
HQ1a: Medusae, venom, 2nd cannon

HQ2: Archon, blaster, HWG, WWP
HQ2a: Medusae, venom, 2nd cannon

Trueborn with 4 blasters, Raider, DL

4 x 5 warriors with venoms and 2nd cannons

Raider, DL

2 x Razorwings, DL

Autarch, fusion gun, scorpion chainsword

3 windriders

5 Fire Dragons,

wraithknight

20 points left for either cannons on the razorwings or fire dragon Exarch with fast shot.

Even though that I clearly can see the reason to get cannons on the flyers (vs FMC) I think I will take the exarch. I dont have much AT so the little I have have to do their job.

Either way you should do fine with this list. Maybe drop medusas for the lhamean for extra points. Or dropping them completely because the arch on can get a dedicated venom anyways and not ride in it