1500 Null Deployment

For what seems to be my first game in quite possibly 3 months, I've put together a 1500 pt Null deployment list to take on my buddies Iron Hands this weekend. Constructive criticism with explanations greatly appreciated. Only things being deployed would be the Talos and possibly the mandrakes if I could sneak a quick first blood with them or to control another objective at the start of a game (we usually play maelstrom).

CAD Detachment

HQ: 75
Lhamean, Venom (2xSC) -75

Elites: 48
Mandrakes x 4 -48

Troops: 585
Kabalite Warriors x5, Blaster; Venom (2xSC) -120
Kabalite Warriors x5, Blaster; Venom (2xSC) -120
Kabalite Warriors x10, SC; Raider DL, EA, Racks - 175
Kabalite Warriors x10, SC; Raider DC, EA, Racks - 170

Fast Attack: 406
Razorwing Jetfighter, 2xDL, SC - 150
Scourges, 4xHWB - 120
Reavers x6, 2xCC Arena Champ - 136

Heavy Support: 385
Ravager, 3xDL - 125
Talos x2, 2xSC, 2xIchor Injector - 260

Total:1499

Not sure I understand how this is going to work? The only Null Deployment method I know (without allies) is by using a Scalpel Formation.

Talos hides and controls an objective, possibly along with the mandrakes, until reserves start popping in. Different take on it instead of a scalpel squad since its "technically" illegal to ally DE with DE.

Since I know that last comment is gonna stir up confusion allow me to clarify. In the BRB it does state (don't know the exact page but I'll find it) that you cannot ally two armies from the same faction. I do understand that many GT regulations ignore this little blurb but we don't where I play. So it's not just DE but everyone, minus those Imperial jerks.

Please do not double post but use edit function instead. You may bumb your thread once every 48 hours to get more answers to it ///Vasara

BRB says you cannot take Allied Detachment from same faction that the primary. Scalpel is a Formation and therefore perfectly legal.

Are formations not a special form of detachment?

A Formation is a Formation. No restriction. There is also nothing to stop you from taking DE twice as 2 CADs.

Quote :

There is also nothing to stop you from taking DE twice as 2 CADs.

Usually tournament rules stop you from doing that and most player do not agree to playing two CADs from the same army, so that depends on your playgroup. Taking a CAD and Realspace Raiders on the other hand is perfectly fine, as they are different forms of detachments.

Okey, enough offtop, lets focus on your list. First and foremost - you could really use some Reserve control here, because just hoping for the right Warlord Trait is rarely enough, unfortunatelly the only reasonable form of Reserve control are Eldar Allies with an Autarch HQ for reserve manipulations. Personaly I detest playing CEldar, but that's me, not you.

After playing some time with lots of Talos on board, I gotta say Ichor Injector is not worth it. It's by no means a bad weapon, however its fleshbane rule rarely gets used with Talos S7 and unless you go against some kinda Tyranid Huge Bros build, there will be no real targets for the ID roll of 6. It's much better to take Chain-Flails, as they give you Shred, which can really ruin your opponent's day with Talos AP2 S7 attacks.

As was suggested earlier by Hellstrom, I'd be a good idea to take a Scalpel Squadron - skip the Mandrakes (they are pretty meh and drop like flies, due to T3 and no save other than Cover so any sort of flamer turns them into ash, especially in small squads. They are a good idea in a blob of 10 against medium-armored (4+ or 5+ etc.) infantry but against marines it's a waste of points) and Reavers - they are a rather squishy (unless with T drugs, but that's luck) and are mainly a cheap source of powerful Hammer of Wrath attacks, but if you plan to use them that way, skip the mandrakes and kit the Arena Champion for close combat. If you skip those units, you will have nice set of points for a Scalpel Squadron.

If you do take the Squadron, scrounge up some points for Ossefactors. These weapons are awesome against Termies and blobs of marines, as they are AP2 Fleshbane that makes the killed unit go boom, which brings you closer to that First Blood, which gives you D3 VP instead of 1 if you use the Squadron to take it.

If you don't want to take the Squadron, it may be a good idea to sack those units anyway and pick a second Razorwing - a lone RWJF is not much on the board, but two can be used to some devious and nasty plays. If not, skip the Razorwing alltogether - it will free you 150 points - that can be a second Ravager and maybe an additional Mandrake.