Help against deep striking Tyranids from hell

Hellstrom wrote:

Just for argument's sake ......

vs MEQ
2 Splinter Cannons = 8 hits ---- = 4 wounds ---- = 1 failed save.  1 dead Marine.
1 Dissie = 2 hits ---- = 1.33 ---- = no saves.  1.33 dead Marines.

You will kill the same amount of Marines with a dissie as 2 cannons, BUT you are more likely to kill 2.  A dissie is better vs MEQ than 2 cannons imo.

Sorry but I don't understand your math.

1.33 failed saves is no different to 1.33 wounds that don't allow saves. So, how is the disintegrator more likely to kill 2?

If anything, I'd have thought the venom would be more reliable because it will retain its kill ratio even if the target is in cover. It also has the potential to inflict more wounds than the disintegrator.

What don't you understand?

The only math that's possible is based on averages. You will regularly roll higher or lower than the average. The dissie has a higher chance to kill 2 models than dual cannons.

I obviously haven't factored cover into the equation.

Hellstrom wrote:

The only math that's possible is based on averages.  You will regularly roll higher or lower than the average.  The dissie has a higher chance to kill 2 models than dual cannons.

But that's the point - the disintegrator *doesn't* have a higher chance to kill 2 models.

The odds of it killing 2 models are identical to the odds of dual splinter cannons killing 2 models.

Sorry Shredder, but the math checks out. On average the dissie will kill 1.33 marines, dual canons will kill 1.

1<1.33

Eh?

12 shots
8 hits
4 wounds
1.33 failed saves

Venom
12 shots, 8 hits, 4 wounds, 4/3 dead Marines

Raider
3 shots, 2 hits, 2/3 *2 = 4/3 wounds, 4/3 dead Marines

In cover it gets less and the Venom is better.

Shredder has it right. 1.33 dead marines for both of them. Put them both in ruins going to ground, though, and the splinter cannons remain at 1.33 dead marines, where dissie suddenly drops to 0.44 dead marines.

Going back to tyranids, what exactly do the 6 Lictors do?

Can they Assault when they appear?

Nope. That haven't been able to do that since the 4th edition book.

So what's the problem?

CptMetal wrote:

So what's the problem?

I don't know - that's why I was asking.

I mean, I'm presuming that they're doing something as the guy is taking 6 of them, I'm just curious as to what that something is.

As I said it's a board control list at its core. No scatter ds, allowing locs the same, msu scoring, generally getting in the way etc. Then consider they answered wave serpents better than other options with 2 str 6 shots at rear armour but more importantly assault. The list is genius but it was built for another meta, just happened to remain relevant. Think msu lone clawed fiends only much better.  Remember it's not one it's many.. Then the heavy lifters. Lastly it's a nids list immune to the usual psych issues they suffer from IB so no real lynchpins.

Yeah, lictors deepstrike in, no scatter, within 6 of my transports. Then fire 2 strength 6 shots each. He did 3 lictors near one boat, and 3 near another. It forced me to jink, which isn't that bad cause i use raiders, not venoms. The problem is he now has 6 individual 3 wound units. Granted they are T4, and can be instakilled. It forces MSU issues, the same issues us dark kin like to implement to our opponents. Do I shoot at the flyrants, the lictors, the locss? I had quite a few wounds go to waste cause I used an entire unit of blasterborn to take out only 1 lictors. Same with my ravagers. Lictors in assault are pretty nasty btw

The Shredder wrote:

Eh?

12 shots
8 hits
4 wounds
1.33 failed saves

Sorry. I have no idea where I got my maths from .......... Ignore me forever