1850 pts of Gunboats

Hi there. I haven't played since 5th edition but me and a few friends are planning on getting back in to the game so I threw together this list. We were fairly competitive when we used to play but not overly, so I'm not worried if the list isn't the absolute best bang for my buck, just that it will have a chance to compete. To the list!

HQ
Succubus
- Archite Glaive
- Armour of misery

TROOPS
10 Kabalites
-Blaster
-Raider with Dark lance
X2
10 Kabalites
-splinter cannon
Raider with Dark lance and splinter racks
X2
5 Kabalites
-Blaster
Venom with second cannon
X2

Elites
4 Incubi
-Venom with second cannon

Fast attack
5 Scourges
-4 haywire blasters

Razorwing
-Dark lances

Heavy support
Ravager
- triple dark lance
X3

So that's the list. Not too sure how it will fair these days, but hopefully you guys can help me with that. I have approx 50 points left over and was wondering if I should use this for Sybarities for the troops. Any help welcome!

Probably not bad to throw in Sybarites to help with the inevitable moral checks from when the gunboats are shaken/stunned or blow up.

You should look through some of the more recent lists in this army list section and get a feel for the prevailing advice. Right off the top, I'd reconsider the full warrior squads in raiders in favor of 5 man squads in venoms.

Also, I wouldn't take blasters on them. If you think you need more dark lances, take another CAD for more ravagers, or just take more scourges with haywire blasters, or add talosi with haywire blasters. Anything but blasters on warrior squads. I know it used to be the greatest thing since sliced bread. I even personally recommended it in the past, but that was when we were limited to ONE detachment. We can now take unlimited detachments per the book, and normally up to 3 in tournament formats, with meta-detachments only counting as 1. Use that to your advantage.

Last thing, I'd drop 1 Incubi and get a Klaivex instead. You lose 1 wound from the squad, but even with the Succubus they'll only have 4 models, so the Rampage and extra attack you get on the Klaivex will result in more offensive output overall for the unit, an alternate option to issue/accept challenges, and 10 saved points.

Okay Betray the world I've taken some of your advice but I'm still keeping the blasters on the kabalites (for now). I remember hearing on one of the Splintermind podcasts that they believed blasters were worthwhile simply because of the utility. If I need the other 60 points or you can find better use for them then go for it.

HQ
Succubus
-Archite Glaive
- Armour of Misery
120 pts

Troops
5 Kabalite warriors
-Blaster
Venom
-Second Cannon
120 pts
x4

Elites
3 Incubi
-Klaivex
Venom
-Second Cannon
135 pts

Fast attack
Razorwing Jetfighter
-Dark Lances
140 pts

5 Scourges
-4 Haywire Blasters
120 pts

Heavy Support
Ravager
-3 Dark Lances
125 pts
X3

Total: 1370 pts or 1310 pts without the Blasters.

I haven't really considered allied detachments yet, but definitely an option. Though I've looked around and lots of people seem to suggest having some kind of anvil unit like a Wraithlord. The group I play with is quite small so I'd prefer not to use units from the dirty craftworlders! I just wondered if that style of unit is worthwhile or whether it would fit in an army like this that's heavily reliant on it's mobility. I would be open to including the corsairs though, as some eldar Jet bikes would be great considering their saves and it would take the pressure off of my Venoms. I'll be facing mostly mechanised lists, so I feel like I'm light on anti tank, what would you suggest? Thanks for your help and sorry about dissapearing, had a busy few days!

I'd make 2 CADs instead of 1 detachment, and add more ravagers. Something like this:

CAD1
Succubus w/Archite Glaive & Armour of Misery 110
2x 5 Kabalite Warriors in dual cannon venoms 210
1x 5 Kabalite warriors in a raider with a dark lance 100
1x 3 Incubi w/ klaivex in a dual cannon venom 135
1x Razorwing Jetfighter w/Dark Lances 140
1x 5 Scourges w/ 4 Haywire Blasters 120
3x Ravagers with triple Dark lances 375
TOTAL: 1190

CAD2
Lhamean in a dual cannon venom 75
2x 5 Kabalite warriors in dual cannon venoms 210
3x Ravager with triple dark lances 375
TOTAL: 660

GRAND TOTAL: 1850

Everything in this list knows it's job. There is no confusion over what you should be shooting at, or whether you're being efficient or not shooting your splinter rifles at a vehicle.

Because of the change to the effects of jinking on passengers, I'd probably not put the raider kabalites in their vehicle. I'd use them as obsec objective campers in a ruin in your own deployment zone, while I used their transport as a dark lance platform. Due to it having no troops in it and only 1 dark lance, it will probably be a low priority target, which means it will likely get to fire it's dark lance several times, and may have opportunities to use it's obsec rule to grab you points.

But that's just what I'd do if I were trying to stick pretty close to your original idea. Of course, the final decision is up to you!

Okay, so I've decided to make a 2000pts list as that seems to be the points value my friends want to shoot for. So rather than clutter up the forum by submitting another post I thought I would submit it here instead. It's fairly similar to my previous list, albeit I'm including a Grotesquerie over the incubi and removing the blasters. Anyways, Here goes.

CAD

HQ
Succubus w/ Archite Glaive and Armour of Misery 110

Troops
4x 5 Kabalite warriors in Dual cannon Venom 420
2x 5 Kabalite Warriors in Dark Lance Raider 200

Fast Attack
5 Scourges w/ 4 Haywire Blasters 120

2x Razorwing Jetfighter w/Dark Lances 280

Heavy support
3x Ravager w/ Triple Dark Lance 375
Total: 1505

Grotesquerie
Haemonculus w/ Scissorhand 80

2x4 Grotesques w/Abberation & Raider 410
Total: 490

Grand total: 1995

Succubus Embarks with one unit of Grotesques whilst the Haemy embarks with the other.
I was thinking I would fill out the last 5pts with Enhanced Sails for The Succubus Raider.

So I'm hoping that I'll be able to pull off a kind of "shock and awe" strategy with the Jetfighters coming on turn 2 and a list geared towards alpha strike. The idea being that if I end up going second I can abuse LoS blocking terrain as much as possible and then make my initial assault turn 2 (hopefully accompanied by atleast 1 JF), or if I get to go first, positioning myself to inflict as much damage as possible on one flank with a somewhat versatile unit in reserve to hit infantry or tanks depending what I need come my second turn.
I'm pretty happy with the outlook for the grotesques, because I feel like no matter what army I face they're going to be a scary enough unit that they should draw attention and fire away from my troops and if they make it to CC they should really pack a punch because of the stacking leadership debuffs.


I plan on using this as a close to "take all comers" list, at least as far as the armies I know I'll face. The armies I'm likely to go up against are Eldar, Necrons and Grey Knights. As far as the Eldar guy goes, I know he'll have a wraith knight in there somewhere and a few 10 man Scatterbike Blobs.
I see my best bet as trying to eliminate his mobility. Either by tying up his bikes with the Grots ASAP or abuse their large footprint with the razorwings (or a bit of both). No matter what I do I can't see myself winning a firefight, but I feel that if I can cut down his mobility and numbers my MSU troops should be able to outplay him for the objective. As for the WK, AFAIK we wound on 6s with poison, right? So I'm struggling to see how I neutralise that. As far as the other two armies mentioned goes, I haven't heard much about what way they plan to run, but if you can think of any glaring weaknesses in my list based on those armies, it'd be much appreciated.

Overall I think the list is pretty good, but the reserved jetfighters hold you back a bit, in my opinion. I think it'd be better to drop both jetfighters and a unit of Kabalite warriors, then rearrange your units into 2 cads + grotesquerie with the following units added: 1 Lhamean, 3 Ravagers with triple lances.

This would give you more of that "Alpha Strike" you mentioned, since unlike Jetfighters, ravagers can fire on the first turn.

Also, I noticed you've added an extra grotesque to each grot unit. I don't recommend this. 4 grots actually performs WORSE than 3 grots when you have a character with them because all grots have the rampage rule. So, with a character, in a unit total of 4, they all get 2 extra attacks on average, whereas in a unit of 5, they typically won't get any extra attacks at all. So you're basically paying 35 points for 3 extra wounds and LESS attacks. Not worth it, in my opinion.

So my suggested list would look like this:

CAD 1
Succubus w/ Archite Glaive and Armour of Misery 110
3x 5 Kabalite warriors in Dual cannon Venom 315
5 Scourges w/ 4 Haywire Blasters 120
3x Ravager w/ Triple Dark Lance 375
Total: 920

CAD 2
1 Lhamean in a dual cannon venom 75
2x 5 Kabalite Warriors in dual cannon venoms 210
3x Ravager w/ Triple Dark Lance 375
Total: 660

Grotesquerie
Haemonculus w/ Scissorhand 80
2x3 Grotesques w/Abberations in Raiders 340
Total: 420

Grand total: 2000

This would give you a first turn alpha strike on enemy vehicles, so that by turn 2, the gooey center is ready to be assaulted by your grot squads.

I hope I helped. Either way, looking forward to hearing what you decide to do! Good luck!