8e - Chaos Daemons

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/05/13/warhammer-40000-faction-focus-chaos-daemons/

But the real question is, can Pink Horrors summon?

From what I have heard summoning will now require you to actually leave points aside from your army list the start of the game when making your army list to create a new unit. You can add models to an existing unit without it costing points, but creating new daemon units costs points.

I am guessing pink horrors splitting into smaller horrors probably won't cost points but if they summon another squad of daemons with a power then it would cost points.

If they have to dedicate part of their list's point to summoning they can do whatever they wish.
No more 1500 vs 1500 but they field 3000.

The important thing is will we have a rule similar to Quicksilver Swiftness?

Forcing summoning to be points based is really really dumb in my opinion since it ruins the point of summoning. I could understand making the cast harder each subsequent summon but shoot, daemons can already deep strike so what advantage does summoning confer?

The advantage would be to have an adaptable list.
You could literally change your list midgame based on what you are facing or how the game is going.

I'd rather have all my points not being bet on a lucky cast value.

Logan Frost wrote:

The advantage would be to have an adaptable list.
You could literally change your list midgame based on what you are facing or how the game is going.

Yeah, I am thinking that undivided chaos will have this advantage. For chaos devoted to a specific god I am thinking there will be bonuses and restrictions for only using units with the "thousand sons" or "tzeentch" faction keywords for playing a tzeentch army. I'm also thinking this is how they will keep khorne daemonkin in the game, maybe using only units with the khorne keywords will give something similar to the previous blood tithe system.

Me too. It's the price to be adaptable and unpredictable, but I don't like to gamble.
And we actually don't know the details about how it works, it could be more reliable than a simple die throw.

It's gonna be like Sigmar where people can deny it. Daemons just got executed with this rule.

TeenageAngst wrote:

It's gonna be like Sigmar where people can deny it. Daemons just got executed with this rule.

Summoning in 7th is complete and utter BS, no army should ever be allowed to field hundreds or even thousands of points more models than their opponent. This mechanic turns summoning into a variable reserves set up which can have it's uses and summoners are going to be better protected in 40K than Sigmar thanks to the rule that you can't target characters if they aren't the closest unit.

Imateria wrote:

Summoning in 7th is complete and utter BS, no army should ever be allowed to field hundreds or even thousands of points more models than their opponent.

Totally agree with this.  Its the opposite of balance.

Just because I don't like the new summoning rule doesn't mean I hold 7th edition's summoning as the epitome of fair and balanced gameplay. Something where summoned units don't cost points but for every unit summoned the difficulty of the cast goes up would be far superior to this ghetto deep strike nonsense. So you can be flexible in your list on the fly, that's great until you realize there's a few compounding issues:

- Having max-sized units is where your power comes from. You can only summon in increments of the smallest unit size. This means summoned units are inherently the weakest form of that unit.

- You can only summon if your summoner survives long enough to do so and isn't near anyone who can deny them, unlike traditional deep strike reserves.

- It's entirely possible you need to set aside those "reserves points" in your list for matched play. This means if you're facing an army where it would behoove you to have all your units start on the table but you already allocated 500 points to "reserves points" for summoning, you're boned. With deep strike you can just pick at deployment what does what and you're good.

- All Daemons have deep strike anyway.

- You can charge out of deep strike now too.

More evidence that we're going to be absolutely bonkers next edition, and evidence that Daemons are going to suck except for a couple of viable builds a-la Tyranids currently. I'm thinking Slaanesh and Khorne are going to be those two lists, and both will be very fast/melee oriented.

I think Nurgle is going to be scary- 16 wounds on a lord of change?!?! (Assuming splinter weapons are equivalently the same as they are now, that would require about 96 shots.) If the lord of change is 16 wounds, a great unclean one will likely have 19-22 wounds.

The thing with summoning is that it is an option. Granted, it is a risky option, but an option nonetheless. If Daemons are balanced properly, then you won't need to be able to summon more in order to win with them. That being said, I think it would be cool if Daemons got a perk that is tantamount to extra reserve points for summoning, or greater ease and reliability to do so. I'm not worried about them being good.