1000pts list - updated! NEEDS MORE CHEESE!

alrighty, so i played with my other list, the other day. and it went really well except i changed it up a little. but i really liked the haem w. liqui in a raider! and low dice rolling for AP FTW!!!

but ok, im starting to hate the 4 TB i ran with the SC and ShC. i need something else that can replace them, that can do really well at taking out troops or something that just works really well.

HQ
Succubus w. agoniser - 85pts

Haem w. liquifier gun - 60pts

TROOPS
9 wyches - 190pts
hekatrix w. agoniser
Raider w. DL & FF or NS
(succubus joins)

9 wyches - 190pts
hekatrix w. agoniser
Raider w. DL & FF or NS
(haem joins)

5 warriors - 125pts
w. blaster
Venom w. SC

HEAVY
Ravager w. DL - 115pts
FF or NS

Ravager w. DL- 115pts
FF or NS

So iv got 120pts spare...what can i fill this up with?? i was thinking another 5 warriors with blaster w. venom or maybe buy a pack of 5 wracks and see how that goes...but please assistance please! tell me what you think i should do! ANYTHING!

More cheese?

Drop a couple of Wyches. Buy Haywire grenades for all the Wyches and also use the 120 plus an additional 5 from saved Wych points to buy a duplicate Warrior Venom squad.

At 1500, if it was me, I'd drop the Succubus and work in an additional Ravager, quite frankly.

yes cheese...everyone wants more cheese on there army! ok i should stop being silly, but what i meant was, it needs more power/something more killy, if thats even possible. im sure it is. but yeah.

but thank you for the advice, but jsut a few questions...
1.) if i do get haywires on wyches, wouldnt the wyches be tarpitted most of the time? that they wont get to use their haywire?

2.) okay, im gonan sound dumb. but i ahve to stop acting like i know. but here, why is everyone saying blasterborns or kabalite warriors w. blaster in venom are the shiz!...like i can see it destroys vehicles and most of the time has an assured kill (if it hits and wounds and the other person doesnt have an invun)...but the thing is, how would you use it? and what makes ti so good? im just really curious now.

3.) would it be better to run a haem and succubus? or haem and archon (but lose a fair bit of stuff)? or just an archon?

gunnerboy1607 wrote:

2.) okay, im gonan sound dumb. but i ahve to stop acting like i know. but here, why is everyone saying blasterborns or kabalite warriors w. blaster in venom are the shiz!...like i can see it destroys vehicles and most of the time has an assured kill (if it hits and wounds and the other person doesnt have an invun)...but the thing is, how would you use it? and what makes ti so good? im just really curious now.

small units do not have a high target priority, so it will be an unlikely target for assault. If charged, you will get killed in a round and thats leaves the attacker in the open in your turn. (Yesterday played against Bugs. He charged me, killed my 5 warriors and his 18 hormagaunts were burned to death on my turn)
Put them in cover and you are even able to survive being shot at.

And the best thing: Your venom! 12 shots with your SC will help your AI, the Venom is definitely hard to kill with its flickerfield - and most of the time your opponent will ignore it because he wants to shoot your ravagers or wyches

gunnerboy1607 wrote:

but thank you for the advice, but jsut a few questions...
1.) if i do get haywires on wyches, wouldnt the wyches be tarpitted most of the time? that they wont get to use their haywire?

2.) okay, im gonan sound dumb. but i ahve to stop acting like i know. but here, why is everyone saying blasterborns or kabalite warriors w. blaster in venom are the shiz!...like i can see it destroys vehicles and most of the time has an assured kill (if it hits and wounds and the other person doesnt have an invun)...but the thing is, how would you use it? and what makes ti so good? im just really curious now.

3.) would it be better to run a haem and succubus? or haem and archon (but lose a fair bit of stuff)? or just an archon?

1. I personally would take Haywire grenades as standard with Wyches, in my experience they will get to use them the majority of the time and they ruin things. Wyches and Bloodbrides have been one of my most reliable Anti-Vehicle choices.

2. It's a lot of firepower for relatively little points cost. The venom itself has the ability to ruin a squad and when you factor in that it's splinter cannons are defensive weapons with a "36 range that can shoot at a different target to it's passengers, it makes a pretty frightening combo. Quite scary to think that if your rolls were spot on you could wipe a 10 man squad and wreck an Av14 vehicle in one phase of shooting .

3. To be honest I've always found that the Succubus will out-perform an Archon and Haemonculus. I also don't like putting a Haemonculus with Wyches, I know they gain a pain token instantly, but they lose fleet and for me the trade-off just isn't worth it in most situations. This is just my experience though and my style of play may be completely different to yours, have a play with both and see what you prefer but I don't think my Succubus has ever failed to make her points cost back.

Hope some of this helped.

@kesharq - that is fair enough! I like the sound of that! Thank you

@3fingers -
1.) so u would still take it even if u have round 9-10 DL in a 1000pts army? (sorry my view on haywire g is still like eh...cause I haven't used them much yet.might try em out though)

2.) yeah that does sound deadly! but just wondering, I'm guessing u disembark ur passenger, so you're able to shoot at one target and the venom can shoot another?? Is that what u meant of it? (it's just cause I though, that they both have to shoot the same target if they're with each other...I'm sorry, I mightve been playing for a while, but there's still some rules I don't understand )

3.) well iv tried using a succubus before, and it wasn't that bad, mostly with her aggy and the amount of attacks she can send out combined with combat drugs. oh, this is the thing with my haem, I bring him with the wyches up to battle, only disembark with they wyches with his pain token, and he's still in the raider cruising around and shooting his liquified out and my haem has been amazing at it, liqui + my crap rolling = destruction!!!

gunnerboy1607 wrote:

2.) yeah that does sound deadly! but just wondering, I'm guessing u disembark ur passenger, so you're able to shoot at one target and the venom can shoot another?? Is that what u meant of it? (it's just cause I though, that they both have to shoot the same target if they're with each other...I'm sorry, I mightve been playing for a while, but there's still some rules I don't understand )

Negative.

You venom/raider shoots at A, the troop inside can shoot A... or B, or C

Thing is, if you move over 15 cm (6"?), you can't shoot from inside.

So the wet dream of "I move 15, shoot the warrior blaster at the LR, open it up, hose with Splinter Cannon the 6 terminators inside, all hit, all wound, 2 wounds each, they all die...

It that: just a dream

Possible? Sure.

Probable? Er....

In my experience, the problem with running 5 warrior with a blaster in a venom is that you either get WAY to close (you want to melta, right?) or you stay at 70-80 cm and basically carry a scoring unit.

And if they become un-transported... those 5 guys are "good for nothing". So I always rather put witches in there, with grenades... because 5 of them WILL put some damage, be it in CC or assaulting tanks.

But this is just a way of seeing things, depends a lot of what you play in your area, terrain, etc etc.

This saturday I got a competitive tournament, donna give my double WWP its true baptism... and I will have 4 "tissue paper" units: 1 x 3 trueborn, 3 blaster... 3 x 5 warrior, 1 blaster.

But they will go by foot and the idea is simple: out of the portal... howdy LR? Psyfleman?

Hope it helps!

Good Hunting

First off, you’re hq. The best thing ting to run for your army would be a single homunculus.
Well let’s start with the succubus. As succubus with an agonizer, cost the same as 5 wyches with an agonizing hakatrix. Ad bit of mathhammer and you find out that a succubus kills 2,1 marines on the assault, and the wych unit of five kills 2,2. Almost the same killing power, but the wych unit have more wounds and are scoring. On a competaive level I see no reson to bring a succubi to battle.

Troops:
With transports strong as a paper plane you should not overload them with troops. Losing one of your raider will mean that you lose large part of your army. Smaller units and more raiders is my advice. More raiders mean more dark lances, and flexibility to your assaults. Right now you are putting 9 wyches and a succubi in one raider.
“Here is my transport with 205pts close combat monsters….pleas shoot something else?”

Ravanger, this is a realible anti tank, but fragile. Av 11 and open toped means that it will explode sooner or later. Mine never survived past round 3. Both nightshield and flickerfield are expensive, I whuld only take nightshield. What nightshield does is that it protects you from melta guns, and keep you out of rapid fire range. Flcikerfield gives you a 5+save that is nice, however a 4+ cover save is for free. Always have this one I cover, ether from terrain or from other raiders.

@tanhausen - ok sweet! thanks for clearing that up! now ill be able to kill more stuff! mwahahah!!!

*sigh* only if that can happen

yeah the only thing im worried off, is that my wych unit will not be able to last and even have the hitting power...thats why iv never tried it...

hahahhaah that list sounds fun!!! have fun and good luck!

@talos - thank you
1.) you did just put up a good point. I might just add another scoring unit or tarpitter rather than succubus...ill try it out, it wouldnt hurt to.

2.) thanks for bringing that up. but the thing is, like i said up above, what if i lower the number of my wyches, and theyre not able to kill their enemy when i needed them for something else. (im just waiting for a quick good reassurance about doing this! and i prob would ) now im thinking of dropping a wych or 2 from each squad. would that be too much to take off or too little?

3.) ok, so take nightshields. haha yeah i just get worried that ill roll a 1 for that dangerous terrain test when i need to get out.

Tanhausen wrote:

In my experience, the problem with running 5 warrior with a blaster in a venom is that you either get WAY to close (you want to melta, right?) or you stay at 70-80 cm and basically carry a scoring unit.

And if they become un-transported... those 5 guys are "good for nothing". So I always rather put witches in there, with grenades... because 5 of them WILL put some damage, be it in CC or assaulting tanks.

But this is just a way of seeing things, depends a lot of what you play in your area, terrain, etc etc.

5 Warriors with Blaster are good for a) blasting at vehicles at max range (Blaster sadly do not have the Melta rule) and b) sitting around helping you to defend markers, quarters and so on

Haven't tried 5 wyches in a venom yet.

Tanhausen wrote:

This saturday I got a competitive tournament, donna give my double WWP its true baptism... and I will have 4 "tissue paper" units: 1 x 3 trueborn, 3 blaster... 3 x 5 warrior, 1 blaster.

But they will go by foot and the idea is simple: out of the portal... howdy LR? Psyfleman?

After my last games with 2 WWP (both with a transport-delivery) I might try your approach (1 on a transport, 1 on foot) when i go first. I'd like to hear of your experiences

@gunnerboy

Reducing squads and so on... it all boils down what you want to use them for.

A buddy of mine has a great phrase "The Elite dies so the Troops win the day".

If you want to multitask those wytches... you're gonna have a HARD time.

That being said.. hit some table, roll some dice and let us know how it goes!

@Kesharq

I followed your advice in my army list post... so got a venom and a raider for the WWPs and will play hide and seek with the 5 warrior units. I know it isn't melta... its just a way of saying "tank busting"

I'm loving the concept, though I know I'll get pounded upon... but man when you get the usual small talk pre-game...

- Dark eldar?
- Yep
- So Venom and raider spam?
- Nope. WWP
- I see...so how many vehicles do you carry? (looks at his anti-mech list)
- 2, but those you'll bring down easy, don't worry.
- Ok... so anything uber nasty like terminators? (looks at his plasmas)
- Er... not really. Most of my army is 6+, a bit of 5+: you bolters will do short work of me.
- (getting nervous)
- Don't worry pal: I have NO CLUE who's gonna win this one... but I promise there will be casualties

(starts unpacking his 85 models)

You gotta love that

(at top of turn 3)

- Ok, so since in the previous turn basically nothing came in... we'll see now.

Hmmmm

2 x 6 bikes zooming, 2 x 5 blaster warrior to catch your read/side of rhinos or predators, 1 of 15 wytches and the odd elite

Well I was thinking of reavers, would they be useful in my army? Before I go buying them.

Thing is, at 1k points, the bikes are quite pricy (150ish points for 6 bikes with double lance).

You've got several easy kill points (aka AV 10 vehicles) and have more than enough mobility...I'd try to get some games with that.

Also, if you can...proxy!!!!

It sucks big time to buy that great unit, unload your hard earned cash... only to find after 2 games that you either don't know how to use it or it simply doesn't fit your style.

For example, when I started testing a WWP list, for 3-4 games, I used terminators as grotesques and regular marines for wracks. I used 20 assault marines for hellions... only to find out that sure, they're a great unit, but not my style. That saved me A LOT of cash.

Heck, I even bought like 30 old DE warrior for fill-in (came out at like 25 Euros, so it wasn't THAT bad for in-sprue bodies).

TL;DR: Proxy and play

Alright, so reavers are for AT? i thought they were just harrasing units/disteractions wuith their bladevanes and caltrops??

Yeah i was just planning to go for a full on assault on a plane technique (so lots of vehicles) which is pretty much what everyone does. But im thinking of building my army, so it wont function very well at objective, but can table the enemy to be able to survive and contest last minute objectives.

Hahaha i made that mistake, friends asked me what i wanted for my bday! and i said hellions (before i started making a list)...and now i got 10 always sitting on the side couldve been wracks instead or other stuff!!

but yes thanks!

I try and stay away from 1 unit = 1 use.

Yes, I defend that units should be STRONG in 1 aspect and not multipurpose...

But thinking bikes=AT...I think its a bit too rigid.

As always, depends on your list, your opponent, the mission, the terrain... bla bla bla

IME, if you plan on going full airborn (4-6 Venom, 2-3 raider, 3 heavy support boats), bikes are far from necessary.

You already have mobility, range and so on.

If you play a list mostly on foot, that even though being able to move+fleet+assault... you simply don't have a HUGE mobility... wich bikes do provide.

Also, Hellions are sweet...but its a very specific unit... 20 of them will just plow through most units.

Be proxy my friend

thank you very much mate! ill give a few things a try!