Commorragh: 6th edition core rule modfications

I thought I would get the ball rolling to see if we can adopt the 6th edition rules for a skirmish game and how we would go about it. Here is my first incomplete attempt. When I mean core mechanics I mean how the movement, shooting and assault phase work. The below are just examples and ideas of how to go about it. Thoughts feedback suggestion?

Use 6th edition rules with the following changes.

Movement

Move through cover: Due to the loose fighting formations of the gangs in commorragh all models have the move through cover special rule.

Hiding: If a model is behind a low wall or other suitable obstacle he may forgo his shooting and assault phase in order to hide. Granting the shrouded special rule. He looses this rule if an enemy model comes within it's initiative state in inches (so a warrior can see hidden models within 5" and a wrack within 4").

Shooting

Shooting Range: Targets within 3" get -1 to their cover saves (point blank). Targets at over half the range of the weapon being fired get +1 to their cover saves (long range). Potentially pistol, rapid fire, assault and heavy weapons could all be affected differently.

Going to ground: in area terrain gives +1 to cover saves (already part of the rules).

Take Aim: If a model didn't move during the movement phase his target gets -1 to it's cover save.

Pinning: All models hit by a shooting attack must take a pinning test, they may re-roll the test if there is a friendly model within 3" (or if this is too strong: a model without a friendly model within 3" gets -1 to it's pinning test). As long as the test is passed a model can be called to make multiple pinning tests in a single turn, but only once for each model shooting at them. Remember a units assaulting a unit that has gone to ground (pinned) do not receive the initiative penalty (part of 6th ed rules).

Note: the pinning rule is important as it adds suppression to the game and encourages models to stick together as they can re-roll pinning tests (you are less likely to get suppressed if your buddies are near by). Its also important as without grenades you strike at I1 when charging through/into terrain, so make sure you get the target you want to assault pinned before charging!

Assault

Mushkilla wrote:

Movement

Move through cover: Due to the loose fighting formations of the gangs in commorragh all models have the move through cover special rule.

Hiding: If a model is behind a low wall or other suitable obstacle he may forgo his shooting and assault phase in order to hide. Granting the shrouded special rule. He looses this rule if an enemy model comes within 3".

I like the hide mechanic, I think that would work well. Maybe have them detected within the opposing model's initiative (in inches) though?

As for move through cover, I think that could be a skill to be gained from experience.

Mushkilla wrote:

Shooting

Shooting Range: Targets within 3" get -1 to their cover saves (point blank). Targets at over half the range of the weapon being fired get +1 to their cover saves (long range).

Going to ground: in area terrain gives +1 to cover saves (already part of the rules).

Take Aim: If a model didn't move during the movement phase his target gets -1 to it's cover save.

I like all of these, but maybe the 'point blank' and 'long range' could apply to only some weapons, included in their individual rules? For example, pistols would be an excellent candidate for point blank.

Mushkilla wrote:

Pinning: All models hit by a shooting attack must take a pinning test, they may re-roll the test if there is a friendly model within 3". As long as the test is passed a model can be called to make multiple pinning tests in a single turn, but only once for each model shooting at them. Remember a units assaulting a unit that has gone to ground (pinned) do not receive the initiative penalty (part of 6th ed rules).

Note: the pinning rule is important as it adds suppression to the game and encourages models to stick together as they can re-roll pinning tests (you are less likely to get suppressed if your buddies are near by). Its also important as without grenades you strike at I1 when charging through/into terrain, so make sure you get the target you want to assault pinned before charging!

I think that the pinning mechanic will be very important - as you mentioned, for suppression. However, I think that re-rolling is maybe a bit too powerful. I was thinking about being able to squad models up and use the highest Ld in the group - however, to squad up they must be in base-to-base contact. Have a leader skill which works over 6" as well? Thoughts?



Generally I really like the idea of cover saves taking the place of BS mods. One thing I think has to change from 6th for the skirmish level, though, is the addition of a movement characteristic. If everyone's moving at 6" or 12" it gets a little bland, in my opinion. I like the idea of beasts moving at different speeds (clawed fiend slower than khymera, for example) and things like mandrakes being a smidgen faster than an average Eldar. However, I do like the random charge and run distances in 6th ed - maybe to keep those a model could roll a D3 for each point of movement it had when charging? Assuming that the standard movement characteristic is 4, I think that would work.

inorexia wrote:

I like the hide mechanic, I think that would work well. Maybe have them detected within the opposing model's initiative (in inches) though?

That's a great idea!

inorexia wrote:

As for move through cover, I think that could be a skill to be gained from experience.

Good point. The main reason I suggested it was there will be a lot of terrain in games.

inorexia wrote:

I like all of these, but maybe the 'point blank' and 'long range' could apply to only some weapons, included in their individual rules? For example, pistols would be an excellent candidate for point blank.

Yes, that would make sense similar to how it's done with different weapons in necromunda.

inorexia wrote:

I think that the pinning mechanic will be very important - as you mentioned, for suppression. However, I think that re-rolling is maybe a bit too powerful. I was thinking about being able to squad models up and use the highest Ld in the group - however, to squad up they must be in base-to-base contact. Have a leader skill which works over 6" as well? Thoughts?

Remember it's per model hitting you, not per wound, and your average leadership is 7-8, if you get hit 3-4 times chances are you will get pinned even with the re-roll. However this is something we could playtest maybe change it to: Models without a friendly models within 3" receive -1 to their pinning test. Basically use some form of modifier instead?

inorexia wrote:

Generally I really like the idea of cover saves taking the place of BS mods. One thing I think has to change from 6th for the skirmish level, though, is the addition of a movement characteristic. If everyone's moving at 6" or 12" it gets a little bland, in my opinion. I like the idea of beasts moving at different speeds (clawed fiend slower than khymera, for example) and things like mandrakes being a smidgen faster than an average Eldar. However, I do like the random charge and run distances in 6th ed - maybe to keep those a model could roll a D3 for each point of movement it had when charging? Assuming that the standard movement characteristic is 4, I think that would work.

Again at the moment I think it's best to keep things simple, there are going to be a lot of rules, so the idea was to try and get the core to be simple but effective and less cluttered than necromunda. As it is I think there is enough differentiation in speed with fleet, infantry, beasts, jump infantry etc. Almost everything in necromunda moved at the same speed anyway.

Thanks for the fantastic input I have added your suggestions to the original post to promote discussion again this is just an example to get people brain storming.

I agree with Mushkilla on not wanting to introduce a Movement stat. The fundamental core of 6th Ed movement is based around 6" and multiples thereof. This allows the use of d6's for moving through cover, running, assaulting etc. To use the same mechanic with a movement stat would require introducing d4's and d8's.

I personally think the movement stat is a vital mechanic in skirmish games. One wouldn't need d4s or d8s for assaults through cover or running - running could be modified to a simple 'additional full movement rate' or something similar. Charges could stay the 2d6 they are, with maybe movement rates over a certain amount getting 3d6 pick two highest, and moves under a certain amount stuck with 1d6.

I would be against everyone getting move through cover - I don't see the point, even. Yeah, the cover will slow them down, as it should.

Necromunda's answer to the pinning thing was you were allowed to use the best leadership within X inches of you (so Juves would stick close to the Gang Leader, et cetera) this was made even more functional due to the targeting rules. I think the re-rolls seems reasonable, I think going with the Necro standard also seems reasonable (indeed, there was a lot of support for trying to make the games cross compatible - so I tend to lean this way, myself)