BR28: Kabal of the Bitter Envy VS Tau Mobile - 1000pts

Another report! This time a bit different. One of our local Tau players lost to a venom spam list at a tournament he attended over the weekend. I overheard him explaining to other Tau players in our group how easy Dark Eldar were to win with. Now Dark Eldar might not be the hardest army to play in 40k, but they aren't exactly straight forward. I started explaining how armies that are fragile and mobile tend to be hard to learn as they punish you when you make mistakes and their mobility lets you overextend unnecessarily. But as the only Dark Eldar player in my group my words fell on deaf ears, they weren't having any of it!

So I asked the Tau player whether he would like to do a little experiment, we would each make a 1000 point list, he would make a Dark Eldar list and I would make a Tau list. We would then have a game and hopefully learn a bit more about each others armies and maybe he would realise that Dark Eldar are as not easy to play as he thought. He accepted.

Now I'm quite picky when it comes to units and the Tau codex is no exception. I'm not a fan of crisis suits, riptides, broadsides, hammer heads, ethereal or crisis commanders. So I was rather reluctant to field any. I wanted to play Tau the way I had always imagined them: very mobile, sneaky and deadly (sounds very familiar doesn't it).

Anyway hopefully both Dark Eldar and Tau players will find this report insightful.

The Armies:

The Kabal of the Bitter Envy (DE)

HQ
Haemonculus, power axe, liquifier

TROOPS
9 wracks, liquifier
rairder
5 warriors, blaster
venom, extra splinter cannon, night shield
5 warriors, blaster
venom, extra splinter cannon, night shield
5 warriors, blaster
venom, extra splinter cannon, night shield
5 warriors, blaster
venom, extra splinter cannon, night shield

HEAVY SUPPORT
Ravager, night shield
Ravager, night shield

Tau Recon Force (TE)

HQ
Fireblade

ELITE
6 Stealth suits, burst cannons, counter fire defence system
6 Stealth suits, burst cannons, counter fire defence system

TROOPS
11 Fire Warriors
Devilfish, disruption pod, sensor spine
10 Kroot
10 Kroot

FAST ATTACK
2 Piranhas, 2 fusion blasters  
2 Piranhas, 2 fusion blasters  

Mission: Crusade (3 objectives)
Deployment: Dawn of War
Night Fight on first turn: Yes
First Turn: DE
Warlord Trait TE: Master of the Ambush (all outflanking units have acute senses) Note: for some reason I forgot to roll on the Tau table
Warlord Trait DE: Night Fighter (can chose to make first turn night fight)

Objectives
He got to deploy tow of the objectives and set them up in his deployment zone. I set mine up in the central piece of terrain.

Deployment:

He set up his force centrally. I set up my devilfish in the central forest and the piranha behind line of sight blocking terrain.

Infiltrate:

I infiltrated the kroot into the forests on either side of the central terrain piece. The stealth suits infiltrated out of sight behind the central terrain piece and the terrain piece on the right side of the board (if you can't be seen you can infiltrate anywhere 12” away, rather than the usual 18”).

Turn 1 (DE):

Both ravagers swung round and fired into the devilfish to no effect. The venoms and their warriors fired into both kroot squads, who went to ground, killing one on the left and two on the right. The raider with the wracks moved flat out behind the central ruin.

Turn 1 (TE):

The piranha moved flat out up their respective flanks. The stealth team on the right jumped out and fired into the side of the ravager stripping two hull points. In the centre the devil fish moved forwards, the fire warriors disembarked and ran securing the top floor of the central building (1 story building no ground floor about 2" high). The stealth suits jumped up and fired into the raider glancing it to a wreck (go mass S5!), they then jumped back behind the fire warriors. The devilfishe's drones also disembarked and used their run and assault move to block the disembarked wracks from getting too close in their movement phase, but leaving just enough space for them to climb up (can't end your move within 1" of an enemy model).

Turn 2 (DE):

The ravagers and the warriors on the right fired into the two piranha only managing to glance 1 (AV11 and 4+ cover is tougher than you think). The the warriors on the left fired into the pirahna on the left but didn't do any damage. The wracks moved as close as they could with the drones blocking them. It took the fire of two venoms on the right to clear out the two gun drones obstructing the path of the wracks (waste of a pain token). The other two venoms fired into the stealth team behind the fire warriors but failed to kill any (go 2+ cover saves!). The wracks brought their liquefiers to bear, unfortunately as the homunculus was behind two squad members (As he didn't want to die to over watch) he was unable to place his flame template without touching his unit). Meaning only one liquefier was fired killing three fire warriors. The wracks charged! The stealth team fired supporting overwatch at BS2 killing three wracks. The overwatch from the fire warriors killed another two wracks (shame volley fire doesn't work on overwatch). The wracks failed their charge due to difficult terrain.

Turn 2 (TE):

The Devilfish moved so that the kroot on the left could embark. Firewarriors fired rapid fire volley fire (3 shots a piece) into the wracks slaughtering them, the fireblade markerlight one of the venoms. The stealth team in the middle jumped forward and managed to get in range of one of the venoms (remember they only had 12" range because of the night shields), wrecking it, they then used their assault move to hide in the wreckage of the raider (passing all their dangerous terrain test and getting their 2+ cover save. The gun drones on the left disembarked from their piranha and killed off survivors of the wrecked venom. The piranha on the right moved forward a firing their fusion blasters into the venom, at BS4 thanks to the markerlights, making it explode, killing three, the survivors were mopped up by the kroot on the right who had moved forward. The stealth suits on the right not being able to get in range of the ravager (damn night shields) used a combination of move, run and their assault move to cover some distance(and not take any dangerous terrain test). The drones used their assault move to screen the stealth suits ensuring they would get their 2+ cover save. On the left flan the piranha pushed up destroying a venom, leaving their disembarked drones to mop up the survivors.

Turn 3 (DE):

Both ravagers moved back and fired into the piranha wrecking one and exploding the other, the explosion didn't kill any of the near by stealth suits. The venom fired into the central stealth suits killing one. The warriors in the venom rapid fired the gun drones killing two.

Turn 3 (TE):

The devilfish with the kroot embarked moved flat out towards the enemy objective. The firewarriors fired into one of the ravager removing a hull point, the fireblade used his markerlight to light up the venom on the left. The piranhas on the left used the markerlight token to fire at BS4 destroying the venom, the explosion killed two warriors. The central stealth team and the two surviving drones moved forward and finished off the warrior. The drones on the right managed to strip the ravager of it's last hull point and the stealth team wrecked the other ravager with it's mass burst cannon fire.

The Dark Eldar are no more. Tau Victory!

TE VPs: 6 (1 objectives, slay the warlor, first blood, line breaker) DE VPs: 0

The Fireblade went missing shortly after the battle. A few days later the Tau found his remains strung from a tree. The medical scanner indicated he had been dead for several weeks, puzzling as he had clearly been at the battle a few days ago...

… He found the pain invigorating as the homunculus began to removed the hoof implants. It was good to be out of that ridiculous outfit, how could the Tau fight in such restrictive armour? No wonder they were such slouches up close. That being said the helmet had proved most useful in hiding his true identity. He wondered whether other Dark Eldar had ever sullied their tongue with a crude alien dialect like that of the Tau? It was an irrelevant question but the thought amused him nonetheless. The Kabal of the Bitter Envy's had been sufficiently culled... and that was all that mattered.

Overview

I have to say playing Tau so aggressively was a lot of fun.

The drones were amazingly useful for blocking movement, screening stealth suits and just being a pain (especially now that they are not worth victory points). The piranha were fast and deadly and delivered the drones where they were needed and provided metla fire. The stealth teams were tough mobile and really put out a lot of fire in both the shooting and the assault phase with their BS2 burst cannons and allowed me to play very aggressively. The fireblade was surprisingly good once he's set up in a nice central firing position, he provided a reliable split fire marker light and volley fire was a great asset once the fire warriors were set up in the middle of the board.

Anyway just goes to show how mobile Tau armies can be, so something for us Dark Eldar to watch out for.

Hope you enjoyed the report.

excellent report mush.

I'm thinking that your opponent should have been more willing to move around. He let you surround him and whittle him down. Had he moved more he may have been able to stay away from some things and get better angles on certain units. He also should never have assaulted with the wracks in the middle. That was trouble waiting to happen. Also by ignoring those stealth suits in his deployment that was probably trouble just waiting to happen. Good job on hiding them there!

Thanks! I guess this reports doubles up as what you shouldn't do as Dark Eldar. Then again that's what I thought my reports normaly were about!

If he had brought Night Shields at all, your stealth suits would have been nearly negated!

EDIT: Looking back, he did have night shields. He really should have done a better job taking advantage of them. Perhaps DE aren't as 'easy to win with' as he thought.

Looks like a really fun Tau list. I recommended something similar to a friend of mine. Mass Piranha with stealth suits. Unfortunately, mass piranha's don't come cheap.

autopilot wrote:

EDIT: Looking back, he did have night shields. He really should have done a better job taking advantage of them. Perhaps DE aren't as 'easy to win with' as he thought.

He only moved 6" as he wanted to shoot with his warriors at full BS, and didn't want to disembark them because of burst cannons. As a result he was way too static, a bad move.

autopilot wrote:

Looks like a really fun Tau list. I recommended something similar to a friend of mine. Mass Piranha with stealth suits. Unfortunately, mass piranha's don't come cheap.

Not sure how viable the list is, but it worked this time round and was a load of fun (worth remembering it was against someone playing an army they don't usually play).

Piranha's are amazing so cheap if you take away the two drones (28pts) a basic piranha is 12pts for a n AV11 fast skimmer, 22pts with a fusion blaster. They really add a lot of mobility to a Tau list and drones have so many uses. Both can be used to obstruct movement (the piranha's a great blocker).

I'm not sure with stealth suits, the fusion blasters are a nice option, but I quite like running them as dedicated anti infantry, 24 S5 shots is pretty mean, especially when it overwatches at BS2 (that's on average 6.6 dead wyches! If they don't charge through cover).

Mushkilla wrote:

autopilot wrote:

Looks like a really fun Tau list. I recommended something similar to a friend of mine. Mass Piranha with stealth suits. Unfortunately, mass piranha's don't come cheap.

Not sure how viable the list is, but it worked this time round and was a load of fun (worth remembering it was against someone playing an army they don't usually play).

Piranha's are amazing so cheap if you take away the two drones (28pts) a basic piranha is 12pts for a n AV11 fast skimmer, 22pts with a fusion blaster. They really add a lot of mobility to a Tau list and drones have so many uses. Both can be used to obstruct movement (the piranha's a great blocker).

I'm not sure with stealth suits, the fusion blasters are a nice option, but I quite like running them as dedicated anti infantry, 24 S5 shots is pretty mean, especially when it overwatches at BS2 (that's on average 6.6 dead wyches! If they don't charge through cover).

Piranhas are a complete steal.

I believe I made up a list with the piranhas all with burst cannons, and the stealth suits take a fusion blaster and target lock for every 3rd man. So you can take 3 fusion blasters/target locks in a 9 man squad, that can ALL target something different. And you infiltrate them, so its an instant threat. FB/TL on a stealth suit is 10 points total, and the FB just by itself is 10 points on a piranha.

This is complete min/maxing, but I thought it a very viable idea.

Again, really liked your take on the Tau list. Now lets see you do another game with the same lists and against the same opponent, just swap lists back. Show him what he should have done differently. :-)

Mush your reports are super helpful and provide much information. I asked one of the Tau players if he has Kroots. He said no and that they suck. I was going to tell him about your reports to show they are a good unit. Thank for showing that here as well as how fast the Tau can be if they want to.

autopilot wrote:

So you can take 3 fusion blasters/target locks in a 9 man squad, that can ALL target something different. And you infiltrate them, so its an instant threat. FB/TL on a stealth suit is 10 points total, and the FB just by itself is 10 points on a piranha.

I think 6 is the maximum squad size on stealth suits this edition. As for the blaster target lock combo that's the other option I was considering. The one thing I noticed (playing against Tau) is getting the suits within 18" of a vehicle (let alone 9") and 18" of an infantry unit at the same time can be a bit awkward, and leave them exposed.

autopilot wrote:

Now lets see you do another game with the same lists and against the same opponent, just swap lists back. Show him what he should have done differently. :-)

That would be interesting, but to be honest, I'm not exactly an experienced venom user (never been a fan), so I might not do much better.

RetroGamer1224 wrote:

I asked one of the Tau players if he has Kroots. He said no and that they suck. I was going to tell him about your reports to show they are a good unit.

They are cheap, scoring and and quite resilient in forest when they go to ground with a 2+ cover save, the nicest thing about them is the amount of freedom infiltrate gives them during deployment. Very handy for a scoring unit. Their leadership is somewhat of an issue though, but that's the same for most Tau units. They have a host of useful options too (krootox and hounds). Great bait for overwatching stealth teams if you can get them on an objective. They just have so many uses!

I get the same response every time I see this Necron player that plays at my local shop. Just yesterday I played a Gray Knights guy who I hadnt played before and he said something similar as well. I am not sure where people get the idea that DE are so cheeze etc etc. I just find it funny that both necrons, and gray knights are top contendors for some of the best capable lists out there.

Great batrep as usual. I am looking into how to really use that battle chronicler so i can start typing up my batreps for people to learn from. By people, i mean me.

Another great BatRep, sir, thanks for the effort you put in. I would also be very interested to see this as a re-match with identical missions and armies, swapped back, if only to see how you deal with your own tactics!

In my opinion (and my opinion is inexperienced, based mostly on your BatReps, my Tyranid experience, and a handful of games), the DE player spread himself too thin, and tried to take on too much in one go: the temptation to go toe-to-toe is high (especially for a 'Nid player), but I am doing better now that I am overcoming it!

I would have thrown the Wracks at the stealth suits on the right, tying their shooting up, set the Venoms on the right-hand Kroot, and pulled the whole battle away from the left.

commandersasha wrote:

Another great BatRep, sir, thanks for the effort you put in.  I would also be very interested to see this as a re-match with identical missions and armies, swapped back, if only to see how you deal with your own tactics!

Well I'll try to find the time at some point then, seeing as everyone is so keen, probably won't be anytime soon though (life is busy atm).

The point to be made just to be fair. Your list is unusual. Crisis Suits on the whole with Burst Cannons are generally more survivable than stealth suits ( also factor in that many list will negate your stealth - Heldrakes, serpent shields, marker lights, and on and on ). That said you used yours brilliantly and many do not realize that you can actually deploy them sometimes even behind your enemy. I applaud the use of a list without reliance on suits or Riptides (well at 100 points 'tides are very expensive anyway). Excellent read.

Another fun report; it's amusing watching Tau being played like Dark Eldar, and vice versa!

Should've known you'd not pick a typical Tau net list, though I thought you'd have more devilfish. Reminded me of a Tau army you played some time ago & had a tough time vs.

I think the DE player didn't take full advantage of NS, was too static, made a big error with not being able to shoot one of his LGs at a vital moment, and the deployment failed to prevent the stealth suits from getting into great starting positions. But not being used to the army, that's mostly understandable. Stealth teams with 2+ cover saves are also quite tricky for DE to deal with (especially with those sneaky BS2 overwatch shots!).

However, that list would have been great vs a more typical tournament-style Tau force, sitting just inside 36" and blazing away.

Are people in your group now agreeing that it's not that easy to win with DE?

Once again a victory for DE... oh wait... is it?

Also, have to ask, is this the same Tau player who you fought with before before? (not sure if you mentioned that already somewhere)

Squierboy wrote:

Should've known you'd not pick a typical Tau net list, though I thought you'd have more devilfish. Reminded me of a Tau army you played some time ago & had a tough time vs.

Yes it is similar to that Tau list I fought a while ago. I really enjoy the deployment options infiltrate gives you and the synergy between stealth teams, drones, movement blocking, screening and overwatch.

Squierboy wrote:

But not being used to the army, that's mostly understandable

Agreed, it's a lot easier to play mobile Tau than it is to play static gunline Dark Eldar.

Squierboy wrote:

Are people in your group now agreeing that it's not that easy to win with DE?

I think they were more preoccupied with me winning with such a quote "Terrible Tau List". So many underrated units in that book!

Mngwa wrote:

Also, have to ask, is this the same Tau player who you fought with before before? (not sure if you mentioned that already somewhere)

No, it wasn't.

Tau are my significant other. I admit, a Tau list without the ethereal, CS, commander, riptide...heresy! And you then crushed your opponent with a list that most Tau players would say was terrible er (noting the titles) less than optimal. You really are a very good strategist, that thinks very deeply about less popular units. Wish I could play you sometime and be turned into a similar dizzied pile of mush! If ever you head to the Antipodes, let me know!
The reason I steer away from stealth suits is because of that single wound and lower toughness value. The Crisis teams I feel are a bit like the reaver squad. They can be formatted for AI or AT, the Stealth can too but to a lesser extent. Perfect CREEEED fluff ending, a real quality read.

DEfan wrote:

You really are a very good strategist, that thinks very deeply about less popular units. Wish I could play you sometime and be turned into a similar dizzied pile of mush! If ever you head to the Antipodes, let me know!

Thanks! Though I wouldn't go that far, I just enjoy thinking outside the box when it comes to army composition, I doubt I would be nearly as successful were I playing in a more competitive environment.

Note to self when going to the other side of the world, bring army case.

DEfan wrote:

The reason I steer away from stealth suits is because of that single wound and lower toughness value.  The Crisis teams I feel are a bit like the reaver squad. They can be formatted for AI or AT, the Stealth can too but to a lesser extent.

Stealth suits interest me because they can be played so aggressively and have a plethora of deployment options. I also find their models a lot nicer than crisis suits (the crisis suits really need an update they feel to squashed, and always appear more elongated and sleek in the artwork). The stealth suits are also quite small models making them easier to hide. That being said they come across as a unit that takes a lot of time, effort and practice to get the most out of, compared to say a riptide which is a lot more plug and play.

Like others have said, I think his biggest problem was playing DE like they were tau. Stayed way to stationary and depended on shooting. Though, his target prioritization may have really been his downfall. It looks like he tried to take your whole army on at once and that never goes well for us.

Was fun to see tau played like the DE. People don't belive me when I say they can be fast and I find them a scary opponent these days.

I don't hear the "DE are cheese" much. Most people I play say things along the line of that is a really powerful army but they can crumble fast when things go wrong.

Our unpredictablitiy is an asset that people don't talk about. We can bring all kinds of lists so it is hard to know how to prepare for us....

Ah, the old "Put your money where your mouth is!" Excellent report as ever  He'll be looking at the table wondering where it all went wrong after that!

DEfan wrote:

Tau are my significant other.

Ditto

DEfan wrote:

I admit, a Tau list without the ethereal, CS, commander, riptide...heresy! And you then crushed your opponent with a list that most Tau players would say was terrible er (noting the titles) less than optimal.

I personally started collecting both Tau and DE when they had massively outdated Codexes, were considered by the all-knowing internet to be poor armies and were rarely met in gaming societies.  I guess I must have a little-guy complex or something.
I also get really wound up by people who say "x is rubbish" because almost every unit can be effective in the right hands and the right situation (except Kheradruakh - he is just pants  ).

Mushkilla wrote:

Stealth suits interest me because they can be played so aggressively and have a plethora of deployment options.

I am also a great fan of stealth suits.  I have seen them slated on forums because XV8 gives you more firepower, higher toughness and more wounds, but I think it's because you can't measure the advantages of infiltration and the stealth field.  They are a *great* unit for getting in your opponent's way and tripping up his plans.

Mushkilla wrote:

I overheard him explaining to other Tau players in our group how easy Dark Eldar were to win with. Now Dark Eldar might not be the hardest army to play in 40k, but they aren't exactly straight forward.

Yes, thank you Tau player. Please tell me about how easy it is to play DE compared to Tau.

I'm curious to hear if this guy changed his tune after the game or if he's still complaining about DE. Also, I can't think of an army which is harder to play than DE.

Nappen wrote:

Like others have said, I think his biggest problem was playing DE like they were tau. Stayed way to stationary and depended on shooting. Though, his target prioritization may have really been his downfall. It looks like he tried to take your whole army on at once and that never goes well for us.

I think this report really goes to show how important it is to take your opponent on piecemeal with Dark Eldar. You need to outmanoeuvre and focus fire and really can't afford to just sit there.

Plastikente wrote:

I guess I must have a little-guy complex or something.

You must be somewhat upset with the new Tau then, it's a fantastic book but they are now one of the top contenders for the most powerful army in 6th.

fuhrmaaj wrote:

I'm curious to hear if this guy changed his tune after the game or if he's still complaining about DE. Also, I can't think of an army which is harder to play than DE.

In my experience there seems to be no middle ground with the 40k community  either DE are an unplayable bottom tier army or blatantly overpowered (no one likes removing their wraithknight/riptide turn 1 because of poison shooting).

To be fair, with dark Eldar it all depends on the list. Against some lists a dark Eldar list is crappy and against others they are a blast. Dark Eldar may not be in the top tier, but they are what you call a king maker.

Had you played a net list, then you opponent would have had it easier then against the list you brought.

That does not excuse the way the tau player plays the dark Eldar, and that your aggressive way was pretty effective.

Like I sad, we make the king....

I don't think that difficulty of playing an army necessarily correlates with what "tier" it's in. I'm just saying that some armies are more difficult to play than others. If you don't understand how to run a gunline or a daemon dog list well then the worst that could happen is you're shooting the wrong thing and you either win or lose.

Knowing how to run a Tau gunline just increases the effectiveness of a fairly easy to play list whereas a DE list can't perform if you don't understand how to use it. That's why these netlist DE armies are fun to play against - their owner doesn't know why they're using these choices.

This is fascinating and useful. I've considered swapping armies before to find out more about my army and to make my friend feel better about his, but never got the chance.

...mind you, he plays Eldar and I suspect there'll be no need to make him feel better about them now.