Competitive Unbound Dark Eldar Army?

I saw that there was a thread started on this topic before 7th ed. was released but was subsequently locked down

Now that 7th has been out for some time, I'd like to know what you guys think would make Dark Eldar as close to 'broken' as possible (just because we can all imagine cool themes but coming up with something better than what most competitive lists have been doing for 6th ed. is more challenging).

For instance I currently run Venom Spam with Eldar allies, but was thinking that the list still lacks air and anti-air assets.

I was thinking of using Necrons, Chaos Daemons or Tau

an army full of blaster born, for approximately 1400 pts you get 8 venoms w 2x cannons each and 32 blasters

add in some farseers and now they are all twin-linked

6 Talos, Chain Flails, TL Haywire Blaster
7 Talos, Chain Flails, TL Splinter Cannon
1460

at 1900 points 11 units of 6 man/woman reaver jetbikes with cluster caltrops or if you split that up thats 22 squads of jet bikes making D6 S6 hits per model wooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo GO FASTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Fun issue. I love the blasterborn spam.

Though, from my experiences with a couple of games last weekend, it seems very difficult to beat the battle-forged DE army with an unbound army in the Maelstrom missions. Tons of raiders/venoms can gain an objective by just moving to it vs the UB army. The UB army, of course, would win the fight for the most cases, but lose the game.

For instance, I left only two units vs unbound SM army of my friend (he crushed most of my units while I focused on the tactical objectives) , but won the game 17 vs 10 - it's huge difference!

HQs:
1 Haemonculus 50
6 Allied Detachments consisting of:
1 Farseer Jetbike 115
1 Warlock Jetbike, Singing Spear 55

Troops:
2x 3 Wracks 60
6 Allied Detachments consisting of:
3 Eldar Jetbikes 51

Heavy Support:
1 Ravager Flickerfield 115
1 Ravager Flickerfield 115
1 Ravager Flickerfield 115

Dedicated Transports:
2 Venom w/2x Splinter Cannon 130

Roster Total: 1841

That's 6 Farseers and 6 warlocks, each with an escort of jetbikes, for a total of 24+d6 of psychic dice per psychic phase, ideal commander on the Haemonculus(Who effects eldar because they're battle brothers), and "Secure Objective" on every one of the farseer units.

Alternatively, if you gave up 1 allied detachment, you could kit out all your farseers with remnants of glory items, and give your Haemonculus a liquifier and arcane relic.

And this is using the "Battle-Forged" rules. You can do some pretty wacky stuff without even using unbound armies.

You could reverse it, and have Eldar be primary, with ridiculous ravager spam.

Primary Detachment(187):
Autarch w/jetbike 85 pts
2x 3 Eldar jetbikes 102 pts

6 Allied detachments (280 each):
1 Haemonculus w/liquifier 60pts
4 wracks in a venom with 2x splinter cannons 105
1 Ravager w/flickerfield 115

That's 6 venoms, 6 ravagers, and 8 units of troops with the "objective secured" rule coming in at 1847. To hit this mark, 2 allied detachments would be sans a liquifier gun.

I personally find it ludicrous that you can't have an allied detachment that's the same as your primary detachment, because it forces us to do silly things like have 3 eldar units leading a primarily DE army, but those are the rules GW gave us. Except for space marines. They get a pass, and can ally with themselves.

You can't ally with yourself, but you can take as many FOrce Org Charts as you want.

So you don't have to take the mini primary, because each 'allied' detachment can comfortably fit into a standard force org.

You could switch it up a bit, too:

Haemy w liquifier, 60 x 5
4 Wracks w venom, 105 x 6
Ravager with flickerfields 115 x 8
= 1850

3 FOCs. Still Battleforged. Still retarded.

Of course, you'd have to paint 8 fricking Ravagers, an absolute deal breaker for me!

Creeping Darkness wrote:

You can't ally with yourself, but you can take as many FOrce Org Charts as you want.

So you don't have to take the mini primary, because each 'allied' detachment can comfortably fit into a standard force org.

You could switch it up a bit, too:

Haemy w liquifier, 60 x 5
4 Wracks  w venom, 105  x 6
Ravager with flickerfields 115 x 8
= 1850

3 FOCs. Still Battleforged. Still retarded.

Of course, you'd have to paint 8 fricking Ravagers, an absolute deal breaker for me!

True, for the ravager spam, that list works well without having to use CWE. 5 Liquifiers and 72 poison shots for anti-personnel/MCs and 24 dark lance shots for armor. You'd get looks for being TFG though. However, TFG or not, I think a list like this would be tournament-worthy if you're looking to actually -win- with DE.

I might even pick a couple of the ravagers to throw dissies on instead of dark lances. 24 dark lances almost seems like overkill.

24 is a lot of dark lances. You could always swap out another 2 haemis for a ninth Ravager, and use 6 dark lance to 3 disintegrator or something.

Maybe 7 and 2, for 21 S8 AP2 shots and 18 S5 AP 2 shots each turn ( plus 72 splinter!)

Why use blasterborn when you can put Fire Dragons in those venoms?

Creeping Darkness wrote:

24 is a lot of dark lances. You could always swap out another 2 haemis for a ninth Ravager, and use 6 dark lance to 3 disintegrator or something.

Maybe 7 and 2, for 21 S8 AP2 shots and 18 S5 AP 2 shots each turn ( plus 72 splinter!)

24 is not enough lance shots at 1850 in my mind... It's the minimum I like to see... Especially with the changes to vehicle damage

Massaen wrote:

Creeping Darkness wrote:

24 is a lot of dark lances. You could always swap out another 2 haemis for a ninth Ravager, and use 6 dark lance to 3 disintegrator or something.

Maybe 7 and 2, for 21 S8 AP2 shots and 18 S5 AP 2 shots each turn ( plus 72 splinter!)

24 is not enough lance shots at 1850 in my mind... It's the minimum I like to see... Especially with the changes to vehicle damage

I think 24 is plenty. However, this does bring to mind some things you could do with target saturation with the new battle-forged system. For instance:

2 Combined Arms Detachments:

HQs:
2 Haemonculus
Troops:
12x 5-man Wych squads w/haywire grenades (11 in raiders, 1 in a venom)
Heavy Support:
3 Ravagers

Total: 1850

That's only(  ) 20 dark lance shots, but you also have 12 units of  "Objective secured" tarpits with haywire grenades, a venom for a little dakka, and you've got 12 vehicles on the board for target saturation.

BetrayTheWorld wrote:

HQs:
1 Haemonculus 50
6 Allied Detachments consisting of:
1 Farseer Jetbike 115
1 Warlock Jetbike, Singing Spear 55

Troops:
2x 3 Wracks 60
6 Allied Detachments consisting of:
3 Eldar Jetbikes 51

Heavy Support:
1 Ravager Flickerfield 115
1 Ravager Flickerfield 115
1 Ravager Flickerfield 115

Dedicated Transports:
2 Venom w/2x Splinter Cannon 130

Roster Total: 1841

That's 6 Farseers and 6 warlocks, each with an escort of jetbikes, for a total of 24+d6 of psychic dice per psychic phase, ideal commander on the Haemonculus(Who effects eldar because they're battle brothers), and "Secure Objective" on every one of the farseer units.

One small problem with your list here. You can only take warlocks when Eldar are your primary detachment (per the Eldar codex).

You could do the same army, but DE has to be your ally and Eldar has to be your primary.

My thoughts:

H.Q. (Archon) & Elites (4x Blasterborne) = 279
4 Venoms with 5 Warriors & 2 Venoms with 5 Wyches = 750
6 Ravagers = 690
3 Windrider jetbikes = 51

At 1850 points that leaves 80 points. I was thinking you could throw in a Venomthrope to give 2 or 3 Ravagers inside ruins a 2+ cover save

Im not really into Unbound armies. I just flat out dont like the idea. So i stick to Battle Forged with all the cool benefits they get.

BetrayTheWorld wrote:

Massaen wrote:

24 is not enough lance shots at 1850 in my mind... It's the minimum I like to see... Especially with the changes to vehicle damage

I think 24 is plenty.

24 shots = 16 hits = 8 glance or better vs AV12. so you just killed 2, maybe 3 rhinos...

and realistically you wont have them all as lances but about 50/50 blasters

and then you wont be able to fire all of them in 1 phase against a good opponent

and then you will loose some in their turn... and the returns diminish.

Nope - I used to work on 1 lance/blaster per 100pts, then 80pts, now its just max it out as much as possible to keep up!

Unorthodoxy wrote:

Im not really into Unbound armies.   I just flat out dont like the idea.  So i stick to Battle Forged with all the cool benefits they get.

agree

Massaen wrote:

I used to work on 1 lance/blaster per 100pts, then 80pts, now its just max it out as much as possible to keep up!

as stated in my above post, you could get 64 blasters in 1800 pts. for me that is more then enough, but it all then depends on your meta, and i honestly doubt that anyone would want to play against a million venoms, especially in my meta where almost everyone hates DE and calls them OP