1500pt slightly Competitive/ all around List

it's suppose to be a friendly all comers list but I might attempt to play it in a tournament.
Comments and Critique are welcome.

1500tps total

Haemonculus Ancent w/ Huskblade, Shattershard, and Webway portal.
4x Grotesques w/ Liquifire gun, aberration w/ Flesh gauntlents
Raider Chain-Snares, Dark Lance, Enhanced Aethersails, Envenomed Blades, Flickerfield, Grisly Trophies, Nightshield, Shock Prow, Torment Gernade Launcher

Haemonculus w/ Hexrifle, Huskblade, Stinger Pistol, Webway Portal.
4x Truborn w/ 4 blasters & 4 haywire gernades
Venom w/ Chain snares, Envenomed Blades, Nightshield, splinter cannon

10 x Wracks w/ 2 Liquifer guns acothyst w/ flesh gauntlet
10 x Wracks w/ 2 Liquifer guns

9x Reaver jetbikes w/ 3 cluster caltrops & 3 Heatlances an arena champion with an agonizer

Cronos Parasite Engine w/ Spirit Probe and Spirit Vortex

How it's suppose to work.
The Haemonculus & the Grotesques are used to drop the webway portal. The Raider if survives the 1st round is then used as ether a large shield or to ram other vehicles/units/models

The other Haemonculus with the Blasterborn will deploy a second webway portal.(only the haemonculus gets out) They then fly around in the venom taking out vehicles and heavy hitting models.

the 9 reavers (or 3 squads of 3) fly over taking out infantry or are used for heavy hunting whatever takes priority.

the wracks, and cronos engine pop out of the web way portals slaughtering the enemy

lululu_42 wrote:

it's suppose to be a friendly all comers list but I might attempt to play it in a tournament.
Comments and Critique are welcome.

1500tps total

Haemonculus Ancent w/ Huskblade, Shattershard, and Webway portal.

In my opinion the huskblade is much to expensive for a Haemi. Yes it is a realy great weapon, but 35pts for a non combat character? The Shattershard is an exelent piece of wargear, just try not to get the haemi killed before he can use it.

lululu_42 wrote:

4x Grotesques w/ Liquifire gun, aberration w/ Flesh gauntlents

People are divided, if Liquifiers are a good upgrade for Grots, I personally think it's ok, but the Flesh gauntlet is to expensive in my opinion. It's no power weapon after all and I prefer the much cheaper Venom blade. (2+ against 4+ insta kill)

lululu_42 wrote:

Raider Chain-Snares, Dark Lance, Enhanced Aethersails, Envenomed Blades, Flickerfield, Grisly Trophies, Nightshield, Shock Prow, Torment Gernade Launcher

Just overkill. You put 55pts of upgrades on a 60pt vehicle. At least no splinter racks, but seriously cut the Chain snares and Envenomed blades, and think twice about grisly trophies and torment grenade launcher. The snares are nice, but not compatible with shock prow, so one is effectively useless. All in all i want my raiders to either move less and fire more or move more with a dedicated target (e.g. ramming or using chain snares) not all at once. If you want to move, you will almost never benefit from grisly trophies or TGLs.

lululu_42 wrote:

Haemonculus w/ Hexrifle, Huskblade, Stinger Pistol, Webway Portal.

Same as above for the Huskblade and too much ranged weapons. Webway on turn 1or2, hexrifle on turn 2or3, when will you use the stinger pistol? For CC just keep the splinter pistol. Furthermore, if he is a shooty Haemi the Huskblade is not only expensive, but redundant.

lululu_42 wrote:

4x Truborn w/ 4 blasters & 4 haywire gernades

Drop the nades, do you realy want to butt vehicles with a four man unit?

lululu_42 wrote:

Venom w/ Chain snares, Envenomed Blades, Nightshield, splinter cannon

Same about the Cain snares and envenomed blades.

lululu_42 wrote:

10 x Wracks w/ 2 Liquifer guns acothyst w/ flesh gauntlet
10 x Wracks w/ 2 Liquifer guns

Maybe you could get an Acothyst for the second unit.

lululu_42 wrote:

9x Reaver jetbikes w/ 3 cluster caltrops & 3 Heatlances an arena champion with an agonizer

I preffer 3 units of 3 but thats a matter of taste. Personally I'm no fan of the caltrops, because they're too expensive, but if you want them, keep them. But loose the Arena champion, they should either be flying over enemys or shooting tanks, not be in CC.

lululu_42 wrote:

Cronos Parasite Engine w/ Spirit Probe and Spirit Vortex

I'd think twice about the spirit probe, but all in all it's a good choice.

lululu_42 wrote:

How it's suppose to work.
The Haemonculus & the Grotesques are used to drop the webway portal. The Raider if survives the 1st round is then used as ether a large shield or to ram other vehicles/units/models

As I said, just kit a raider for what it's meant to do, not everything at once. Raiders are paper planes. Wet paper planes. Wet by gasoline. Flying over a fire. Just expect them to die, sooner then later.

lululu_42 wrote:

The other Haemonculus with the Blasterborn will deploy a second webway portal.(only the haemonculus gets out) They then fly around in the venom taking out vehicles and heavy hitting models.

What will the Haemi do on his own? Hes equipped like Rambo, just keep in mind he's not.

lululu_42 wrote:

the 9 reavers (or 3 squads of 3) fly over taking out infantry or are used for heavy hunting whatever takes priority.

the wracks, and cronos engine pop out of the web way portals slaughtering the enemy

I'd preffer the 3x3 option, but everything very solid down here.


By giving the first heami a venom blade instead of a huskblade, taking away the seconds huskblade and stinger pistol, cutting the mentioned Vehicles upgrades, haywire grenades and the Arena champion i was able to carve off 183pts. Thats a lot, use it for something more usefull, like a Talos, Ravager or more wracks.

All in all it's a good basis, but try to use your points wisely, Dark Eldar can't take the liberty to waste points.

Thanks for the reply. I have a tendency to spend the points on things i want then have a bunch left over so i just throw them onto random things. I'll defiantly go through optimizing the list and report back.

Thanks again.

also for got to mention that the haemy with the hex rifle would be getting back in the venom if able.

Ok, sounds good, just hope you don't realy mean, you'll go through optimizing the list defiantly.

Just keep in mind, that even small summs add up immensely and you'll be fine.

Good luck.

Oh, and try to get some more dedicated AT-firepower into the list.

1497pts

* Haemonculus
* Haemonculus
Huskblade Shattershard venom Blade Webway Portal
* Haemonculus
Hexrifle Webway Portal

* Grotesques
4x Grotesques Liquifier Gun
* Aberration
Flesh Gauntlet
* Raider
Dark Lance, Flickerfield Shock Prow Torment Grenade Launcher

* Kabalite Trueborn
* 4x Trueborn
4x Blaster
* Venom
Nightshield, Splinter Cannon

* Wracks
2x Liquifier Gun 10x Wracks
* Acothyst
Flesh Gauntlet

* Wracks
2x Liquifier Gun 10x Wracks
* Acothyst
Flesh Gauntlets

* Wracks
2x Liquifier Gun 10x Wracks


* Reaver Jetbikes
3x Cluster catrops 3x Heat Lance 9x Jetbikes

* Cronos Parasite Engine
Spirit Vortex

Okay so i was able to shave off enough points to add another squad of wracks.
What would be a good choice for dedicated AntiTank?I was planning on using my trueborn for that.

lululu_42 wrote:

* Haemonculus
* Haemonculus
* Haemonculus
Huskblade Shattershard venom Blade Webway Portal
* Haemonculus
Hexrifle Webway Portal

I think you mixed something up here. Do you mean:
* Haemonculus
Huskblade Shattershard
* Haemonculus
venom Blade Webway Portal
* Haemonculus
Hexrifle Webway Portal

Looks ok, by the way, more cost efficient then the first build. I still think the Huskblade is too expensive, but it's the best weapon we have after all. Just mind the synergy if you don't encounter MCs don't keep the Hexrifle with the Trueborn, shooting at vehicles the points are wasted.

For AT you have one Raider-DL, 4 Trueborn-Blasters and 3 Reaver-Heatlances with a BS of 4 this means the Trueborn will hit one vehicle. The remaining Units have a 2/3rd chance so you will need at least two to ensure one hit, that are two other vehicles hit. A 1500pts mech list contains much more than 3 vehicles and the reavers are very short ranged, so it will happen frequently, that they are not in range or die after an attack. The massive amount of Wracks can't kill any infantry that is not disembarked, so I would fear a well meched opponent, who downs your Trueborn first turn and then eats your list piecemeal.

Sorry was trying to use mu phone. Its 2haemunculus 1 w/ venom blade, huskblade and webway portal the other with the hex rifle and webway portal

Ifm thinking of sacking the 3rd unit of wracks for a ravager with flickerfield to help deal with vehicles and such leaving me 8pts short.

lululu_42 wrote:

* Haemonculus
Huskblade venom Blade Webway Portal
* Haemonculus
Hexrifle Webway Portal

Quick thoughts on these;

1. You can't effectively combine a Venom blade and Huskblade - so you're paying extra points 'in case' you need the other one. I don't really see the huge value - if the Haemy gets butt by something he can't handle with the Huskblade then I don't see why the Venom Blade is going to make a difference.

Frankly, as an butt option I think the Haemy is fairly meh, but the way to go in my mind is either the Venom Blade or Scissorhands. Also, with the way you're using them, I'm really not too big of a fan tricking them out much at all.

2. The Hexrifle...is really pretty terrible. I ran them for a while with my WWP list and was consistently underwhelmed by what they could do. It got bad enough that half the time I was just talking them up enough to try and get my opponent to kill the Haemy and waste a turn of shooting/butt on them as opposed to hitting something valuable.

Quote :

* Grotesques
4x Grotesques Liquifier Gun
* Aberration
Flesh Gauntlet
* Raider
Dark Lance, Flickerfield Shock Prow Torment Grenade Launcher

I'm actually (for a WAAC DE player ) pretty fond of Grots. That said, I don't think they're being used well here. They can't really leave the Haemy, and the Haemy will be wanting to hop out and do WWP shenanigans, and then you'll either be trying to butt things in range of the portal (which should be left up to things coming out of the portal, yeah?) or you'll be wasting yet another turn loading back into the Raider and...basically it's about 1-3 turns of the Grots not stomping heads in, and at that stage - what's the point?

I think you should have the Grots coming out of a portal with Haem handler You would need some extensive point adjustment to accomplish that, but I'd at the very least definitely run yourself through a couple sample opening moves with your army. Just set it up (or stand in paint pots, whatever) on a tabletop. Figure out the movement decisions you are making to deploy your portals and ask yourself if you're getting the needed value out of this unit. Yes, it's awesome, but how many rounds of shooting will it have to survive before you're butt things?

Quote :

* Kabalite Trueborn
* 4x Trueborn
4x Blaster
* Venom
Nightshield, Splinter Cannon

Content with this. I'm guessing this is where the sniper Haem will live. I use Trueborns as the carriers in my own WWP list, so I think this is smart money. Another easy point shave available to you is trimming the Warriors from 4 to 3 - saves a nice bundle and doesn't really make the unit any weaker.

Quote :

x2 * Wracks
2x Liquifier Gun 10x Wracks
* Acothyst
Flesh Gauntlet

Fine, very infantry focused - keep that in mind when I discuss the bikes below. This unit will own infantry, it will stoically look at mech.

Quote :

* Wracks
2x Liquifier Gun 10x Wracks

Another good thing to shave points for, natch. It's okay and is another anti-infantry option, just like the other Wracks, the Venom, the Haems, and the Grots.

Quote :

* Reaver Jetbikes
3x Cluster catrops 3x Heat Lance 9x Jetbikes

I didn't read the earlier posts, so maybe you've already explained that RJBs are your favorite thing ever, but I am *super* neutral about them in this list. You're paying a lot of points for a unit that can't use all its wargear as it can only use the Caltrops *or* the Lances - so you're paying a lot of points (a LOT) for a surprisingly fragile unit that is a generalist unit, but not too brilliant at either job you're giving it. These would, by far, be the first thing I'd drop from the list.
Even if I really wanted them I'd probably at least split them up into 3 units of 3 each, and make them either a Caltrop or a Heat lance unit. Frankly I think the Lances are better for you, you could use the anti-tank quite a bit, and the Grots and Wracks should be in charge of taking care of infantry - not fragile semi-decent hitting bike units.

Quote :

* Cronos Parasite Engine
Spirit Vortex

I think this is a mistake.
Your Grots are starting with 2 tokens (theirs plus Haem).
Your Wracks start with 1 each.
That's giving everyone FNP and the Grots FC. So, really, you're getting a Chronos to...help the RJBs? To help accelerate the Wracks to FC? Meh.
I'd rather have a Talos roll out of the portal - that thing is pure vehicle eating power and MEQ munching fury, and basically requires anti-tank weapons to deal with. I just don't see the Cronos being needed for an army already rich with pain tokens.

Zang wrote:

Okay so i was able to shave off enough points to add another squad of wracks.
What would be a good choice for dedicated AntiTank?I was planning on using my trueborn for that.

Trueborn are okay anti-tank. Ravagers are better, but you need the transport craft making them a decent option in this list.
Your big point sinks are the Trueborn, the Grots, and the Bikes.
Since you need the Trueborn for both their anti-mech and also their transport craft the easy places to look to save points are the Grots and the RJBs. You really should get a bit more of a focused anti-tank option on the board to make sure your Wracks have targets. I also think a Talos would serve you far better than the Cronos, and probably a Ravager could almost serve you better yet, but that is another questionable service slot.

Hope the thoughts help,
Thor.

Do you have a lot of Nidzilla lists? multiple flesh gauntlets and a huskblade make me think you see alot of multiwound models.

I like the Aberation upgrade on the Grotesques, but I'd go the scissorhands over the flesh gauntlet, because it is a slightly better poison weapon, and you'll get an extra attack out of it. Keep in mind if your opponent is T5 or less you re-roll to wound.

I personally like putting an agonizer on the Wracks, but more and more I'm thinking leaving the 2 poison weapons may be the best. With the number of total poinson attacks the squad gets, I think a flesh gauntlet may be in the same boat, better served by the 1 more poison attack from not taking it.

Thor665 made a good point about the WWP droping Haemie leaving the grots, for that sake you may want to consider either adding both haemies with the grots, or a bare WWP deploying Haemie. to tag along with them, and drop the WWP off the asault haemie.

I dont know the tournament meta in my area but i know there are a good amount of grey knight players some tyranids and the rest are some sort of space marines. Im most likly going up against nids and greyknights. And one necron player.

Im a pretty big fluff junky and i love the fluff of tue hexrifle thats why its there ^_^
Also i love the reavers. Like there the only reason why i jumped on DE like a hobo on a ham sandwhich.

I'll rethink the flesh gauntlet now im not too sure about the rules but i figured i would be able to jump out of the raider drop the portal thenthere charge into something. Now i know aganst mech armys that would be a bad idea ^_^

I will be testing my list tuesday against tyranids and maybe necrons. Then thursday ill be playing against chaos marines so i will definitaly keep everyone updated on how things go.

Okay I played against Tyranids 1500pts Annihilation. Game lasted till the end of turn 3.

What I leaned was that I prefer the reavers to ether be a group of 9 or 3 groups of 3 with all of them travailing as a pack.

Grotesques worked out well with the humonculus.
Raiders are useful even when no one is in them (forgot about it after turn 1)
Need to hit harder.
Also not to forget things.

So today i tweaked the list a little bit.

1487pt

Haemonculus
Agnoiser, Shattershard , Venom Blade , Webway Portal
Haemonculus
Hexrifle, Webway Portal

Grotesques
4x Grotesques, Liquifier Gun
Aberration
Scissorhand
Raider
Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

Kabalite Trueborn
4x Trueborn
4x Blaster
Venom
Nightshield, Splinter Cannon

Wracks
2x Liquifier Gun, 10x Wracks
* Acothyst
Scissorhand

Wracks
2x Liquifier Gun , 10x Wracks
* Acothyst
Scissorhand

Reaver Jetbikes
3x Cluster catrops, 3x Heat Lance, 9x Jetbikes

Ravager
Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Nightshield

Talos Pain Engine (115pts)
Chain-Flails, Twin-Linked Haywire Blaster

or

1497pt

Haemonculus
Agnoiser, Shattershard , Webway Portal
Haemonculus ancent
Casket of Flensing, Agnoiser, Webway Portal

Grotesques
4x Grotesques, Liquifier Gun
Aberration
Scissorhand
Raider
Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

Kabalite Trueborn
4x Trueborn
4x Blaster
Venom
Nightshield, Splinter Cannon

Wracks
Liquifier Gun, 10x Wracks
* Acothyst
Scissorhand

Wracks
Liquifier Gun , 10x Wracks
* Acothyst
Scissorhand

Reaver Jetbikes
3x Cluster catrops, 3x Heat Lance, 9x Jetbikes

Ravager
Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Nightshield

Talos Pain Engine (115pts)
Chain-Flails, Twin-Linked Haywire Blaster

With the Second list the second Haemonculus will travel with the grotesques and other Haemonculus thus freeing up the blasterborn to shoot at something turn1 if able.