Dark Eldar and Allies

Pathfinders are of course a sure thing. For the rest of the Eldar codex I would consider:

Dire Avengers: Short range, out splinter troops are more versatile. Nope.
Howling Banshee's: Very expensive, but Exarch w/ Mirrorsword ignores armor. Wyches should be better. Nope
Fire Dragons: We already have good and cheaper anti-tank. Plus these guys are slow and die in droves. Nope
Striking Scorpions: Like Incubi except with pistols and infiltrate. No power weapons. Fills a good combat roll. Maybe
Dark Reapers: Good ranged anti-personel troops. Very expensive. Maybe.
Swooping Hawks: Out troops are better. Nope
Warp Spiders: Very good. Attacks ignore armor saves and 3+ armor, and very very fast. Good choice for allies.
Shining Spears: Would be good in a thiemed army, otherwise doubtful.

I do want to point out the heavy support choce of "Support Weapon - Vibro Cannon." These guys auto-glance anything with a armor value. Not only that, but all in a 36" line. This could destroy multiple tansports. I will be playing with these myself t see how well they work out.

War Walkers or a Vibrocannon would probably be the way to go for HS slot. War Walkers are among the only reasonably priced Eldar units, costing 40 points a Walker for two shuriken cannons. A squadron can outflank and rain masses of s6 shots at enemy rear or side armour. Vibrocannon, as mentioned, will glance anything on a 36'' line (also does D6 s4 hits to any non-vehicles on the line). They have diminishing return tho, as further cannons just make you more likely to hit (one of the cannons in the battery must hit so you can draw the line) and increase the damage to non-vehicles (you still only do 1 glance per vehicle, regardless of the number of cannons).

Eldar FA slot is still not that great. Hawks have haywires, but they are easily shot down and generally inferiour to our Scourges. Warp Spiders are actually quite powerful, being very mobile with decent save and s6 guns. They can glance most lighter vehicles to death. I know an Eldar player who used them to geat effect in 5th, and they've only gotten better. Also, if FW units are allowed, the Nightwing goes here, allowing us to have 2 flyers and still run double Ravagers. Nightwing is slightly more vulnerable than our flyers only having 2 HP, but it is extremely manouverable (can turn another 90 degrees at the end of its move) and gets a 3+ save if it evades (it has a 5+ save even when not evading).

Troops: Rangers/Pathfinders (I would prefer Rangers. They're cheaper, altough they do have 1 less cover save). Huge Wraithblob might be funny, but really expensive.

Elites: Dragons have Meltaguns, but you need the way overpriced Wave Serpent to make any use of them. Smaller unit of Wraithguard might work as a Farseer bunker (get the power that lets you overwatch with your own bs and nothign wants to charge you). Scorpions are essentially inflitrating Incubi that trade power weapons for more attacks. They also get a powerfist and grenades. Can no longer charge after outflanking, but they're still a decent unit for denying objectives or killing non-dedicated cc units. Technically you need to use the Eldar Harlequins to get the new Veil of Tears (since GW forgot to FAQ it to us...).

HQ: Eldrad or Jetbike Farseer, depending on whether you want a cheaper and more mobile Seer or the psychic awesomeness that is Eldrad.

I'd test Jetseer+Baron+Hellion blob soon. Doom and most powers of Divination can contribute them (and Fortuning dark eldar is still question w/o answer, thx Kelly). Also that kind of seer is mobile, and he is safe until utter destruction of blob.

OK I've read the Eldar codex front to back. My opinion is that there are great opportunities for putting down allies, but sadly most Eldar are hugely overpriced. Even the lowly Guardian is 9 points, while both his/her weapon, BS/WS and I are worse than the 10 point Warrior. So then I'd rather put down warriors instead!

The only valid troops (for me) I see right now are these awesome Rangers. And I love the Falcon as well, but again it can be replaced by a Ravager. Falcons with Striking Scorpions or some such would be a very cool addition to my list, but somehow I believe that when I finally get my wych cult ready, they will be launching a new Eldar list anyway, so I'd rather wait before putting down Eldar corsair allies.

Yeah, a pity about not putting down psykers, I guess however that the enemy psykers will just become priority one assault target for me.

However, I DID found some excellent fluff ideas in the Eldar codex! What about these 'Ghosts of Altansar' on page 57? So they remained in the Eye of Terror for thousands of years, only to be saved by Maugan Ra. How have they been changed? And if they are shunned by all Craftworld Eldar, wouldn't they willingly turn to the Dark Kin instead?

There is such option as Guardian Jetbikes. Surely, they are worse then Reavers for same points. but they are Troops, they can maneuvre during the game. and contest/claim obj on latest turns.

And three of them cost 66 pts and fill "1 troop" requirement. 5-6 of them with 1 or 2 SC and Warlock aren't really easy to kill, escpecially if your army is full of greater treats.

And they are good in Relic mission ^

Hijallo wrote:

There is such option as Guardian Jetbikes. Surely, they are worse then Reavers for same points. but they are Troops, they can maneuvre during the game. and contest/claim obj on latest turns.

And three of them cost 66 pts and fill "1 troop" requirement. 5-6 of them with 1 or 2 SC and Warlock aren't really easy to kill, escpecially if your army is full of greater treats.

And they are good in Relic mission ^

Hmmm... Perhaps!

Chaeril wrote:

However, I DID found some excellent fluff ideas in the Eldar codex! What about these 'Ghosts of Altansar' on page 57? So they remained in the Eye of Terror for thousands of years, only to be saved by Maugan Ra. How have they been changed? And if they are shunned by all Craftworld Eldar, wouldn't they willingly turn to the Dark Kin instead?

When I read that (because obviously I rushed out and bought the Eldar codex as soon as I realised I could field Pathfinders!) I thought "Wow, they were practically created specifically to ally with." They seem like a good choice, and the fluff options are good too. Plus you can then legitimately field Maugan Ra without feeling cheesy and exploitative!

This alliance option has actually made me address my priorities with how I play - do I want to play to win, or do I want to play to tell a great story and have fun? I'm leaning towards the latter option, which is why Harlequins might be seen back in my list, along with a couple of squads of Pathfinders and a Farseer. The thinking behind it is that in any given scenario, the Pathfinders are a scouting force, who call in their dark allies when they come across a mutual enemy, or just something they can't handle. I will invoke challenges at every opportunity, even if I'll lose. Expensive characters will perform glorious interventions to spare lowly warlocks. Harlequins will be on the field because they fit the fluff of how the two sides might communicate. It might not be competitve, but it will be epic to write up!

Oh, and a Fire Prism, with all the trimmings. I always wanted one of those! I'm so going to end up with a full Eldar army with two of them...

Baron as HQ and Warlord.
Haemy with Hex Rifle.
3 Beastmasters, 5 Khymerae, 4 Razorwing Flock
Eldar Farseer on Jetbike with Singing Spear, Spirit Stones, Runes of Warding, Guide, Fortune, Doom.
6 Pathfinders
3 War Walkers with Scatter Lasers.
1 Aegis Defense Line (ADL) with Quad Gun.

Haemy deploys with unit Baron, Beasts and Farseer.
Pathfinders deploy near ADL and the Haemy.
War Walkers deploy near the Farseer to get Guide.
Heamy moves to the ADL and mans the Quad Gun.

Beastmaster unit with Farseer and Baron:
* +1 to go first;
* has 5 characters for challenge shenanigans;
* moves 12 inch, assaults 2d6" with reroll;
* has offensive and defensive grenades;
* rerolls saves when Fortune is up (rerollable 2++ shadowfield);
* rerolls hits when Guide is up;
* rerolls wounds (with possible Rending) when Doom is up;
* has stealth and night vision;
* has hit and run with reroll at I6;
* forces all enemies to take psychic tests on 3d6;
* has partial feel no pain.

Pathfinders with Heamy and Quad Gun:
* fires a Quad Gun when enemy reserves come in at BS4;
* fires a bunch load of sniper shots in your own turn (chance on precision shots with AP1 and rending);
* one nasty hex rifle sniper shot (probably won't work ever, but extremely funny if it does);
* has a 2+ cover save behind the ADL;
* has night vision.

War Walkers:
* 24 strength 6 shots at BS3, possibly twinlinked if Guided;
* (that's 7 strength 6 hits on average against flyers if Guided).

Mr Believer wrote:

This alliance option has actually made me address my priorities with how I play - do I want to play to win, or do I want to play to tell a great story and have fun? I'm leaning towards the latter option, which is why Harlequins might be seen back in my list, along with a couple of squads of Pathfinders and a Farseer. The thinking behind it is that in any given scenario, the Pathfinders are a scouting force, who call in their dark allies when they come across a mutual enemy, or just something they can't handle. I will invoke challenges at every opportunity, even if I'll lose. Expensive characters will perform glorious interventions to spare lowly warlocks. Harlequins will be on the field because they fit the fluff of how the two sides might communicate. It might not be competitve, but it will be epic to write up!

You know, that's a beautiful idea! A very nice neutral intervention force which actually sees a long term plus for the combined species in a particular Dark Eldar strike...

CWE/DE alliance is good beacuse it actually makse sense fluff-vise. Even having just a small group of Eldar. After all, they go out of their way to avoid casualities, so why send the whole warhost when you can just have some outcasts to tell the Dark Kin about a world they could raid?

Another Craftworld that might fit as allies is Lugganath, who have very close ties to the Harlequins, and are lookign to leave realspace and take up a permanent residence in the Webway. That would be bound to result in more contact with the Dark Kin, and since the Harlequins often act as meditators between the two groups, one could see them fighting together.

My own Eldar (who I've had almost as long as DE, altough I sold a lot of them last year) are Biel-Tan, who would fit with Dark Eldar pretty well too, since they're violent Eldar supermacists who want to unite the Eldar race and brutally kill any lesser race occupying the worlds that are their by right.

Nomic wrote:

My own Eldar (who I've had almost as long as DE, altough I sold a lot of them last year) are Biel-Tan, who would fit with Dark Eldar pretty well too, since they're violent Eldar supermacists who want to unite the Eldar race and brutally kill any lesser race occupying the worlds that are their by right.

Naaahhh... OK they're violent and warlike, but very little fun for a Dark Eldar, all that doom and gloom... If you slaughter and massacre, at least try to act SOMEWHAT pleased about it!

ive been toying with good old ulthwe...they have always been a bit of a meddler in others affairs ( eldrad was well known for this) so, to me at least, they seem like a decent choice as an "ally". whether they are pulling the strings or the dark eldar are humoring their kin on a whim remains to be seen....

It's funny, in 3rd Edition I used to play against two close friends of mine with different Eldar armies, and the unit they always had the most gripes about were Pathfinders. They still used them, because we were 12 and the basic rule was "put everything you own on the table", but either they never did much damage or their role wasn't very flashy. I suppose that's the lot of most Troop choices out there- the "6 Troops" cap always seemed like a joke, who would run more than 6 Troops, or 2 Troops for that matter? Well, the Dark Eldar player with 48 Warriors, for one!

The Pathfinders may get the last laugh on me and my friends if they turn out to be some sort of MVP in 6th.

I'm really tempted by War Walkers with scatter lasers, and anything starting with Wraith.

3Fingers wrote:

I'm really tempted by War Walkers with scatter lasers.

... until you calculate their price with full weapons. Better to take a Ravager. Otherwise I would spam War Walkers myself.

true, you pay 10 points for 1 extra shot and 12", and the AP on scatterlasers is worse...

Farseer with Spirirtsone with guide and fortune is quite nasty. Bigger game add some Doom-love. Ok, I am Eldar player and have played somewhat with them. Although 5th edition is bit different than 6th now. Pathfinders rock now: you throw 6's now when you shoot. you can place the shot and its AP1!! (5-6 are AP1 for pathfinder) You throw 6's in to hit face its rending shot.

10 Wraithguard with farseer with fortune is nothing to sneeze at (and 10 wraithguards is counted as troops choice with spirirtseer). Sure they're slow, they shoot 12" but they hit 3+, they wound 2+ and their cannons are AP1. + Any to wound hit that rolls 6 will remove character out of game. Eternal Warrior or not as he gets sucked into the warp... Besides everyone are used to t3 eldars when they shoot with s4 weapons and I tell, they got t6... the face is really worth seeing...

warwalcers can carry 2 scatter lasers, that arent twin linked and can be fired separately, so a warwalker for 20 pts, can fire +5 shots.

3 WW's in squadron with scatters put 24 str 6 shots 36". Nothing to sneeze about in hail of outflanking torrent of s6 shots. Though 3 ww's with scatters is 180p while shuricannons its 120p. You loose 6 shots and 12" of range but outflanking... 24" is plenty.

3 WW's in squadron with scatters put 24 str 6 shots 36". Nothing to sneeze about in hail of outflanking torrent of s6 shots. Though 3 ww's with scatters is 180p while shuricannons its 120p. You loose 6 shots and 12" of range but outflanking... 24" is plenty.

^this

the extra 6 shots are not worth 60 points...

lets make this fair, 120 for 2 walkers with 4 s.lahzorz vs 115 ravager. Target av11
first, ravager: 3 shots bs 4 s 8. 1 hull point.
second: 2 walkers, 16 shots, bs 3 s6. 1.87 hull points. the extra shots are worth the points...where else do you see a 87% increase for 5 pts?

Wraithguard would be a tempting option, if only they didn't cost an arm and leg, both in game and in reality. Still, I'll have to have a go at proxying them at a game or two with a Conceal Spiritseer as the mandatory ally troops choice.

Siticus: put in a jetseer council with enbolden and enhance, fortuneseer, all with spears, the rest of the locks with destruction, and template the hell out of the enemy...maybe a doom and a s.stone as well..reroll fail to wounds with destructors...aka twin link flamers...ouch.

but do nothing to armor 13+... also, you could pay 100 points for 12 shots that will have almost thw same effect... the points arent worth it...

also if youre firing scatter lasers/shuri cannons at vehicles, youre doing it wrong...

scatter laser is ap6, so short of orcs, transports are the way to go.
if i want to be shooting at something that can die from it, than i would take star cannon and shoot at termies, or marines.

btw, i dont take warwalkers, they interfere with falcons and prisms to be taken