How to use rangers/pathfinders

I'm considering taking Eldar allies...I want to take Rangers. What should use with them? HQ? Powers?

First thing you want to do is upgrade them to Pathfinders. So worth the points.

They have Infiltrate. They are the last to be deployed. When rolling to hit either a 5 or 6 is AP1 (ignores armour) and they always wound on a 4+ (like Poisoned) so they are good at high T stuff or good at thinning out Termies.

They have a range of 36" so you can deploy them back a bit to still cover most of the table. They also have +2 to their cover save so are awesome at camping objectives. You could take a Farseer and Guide them and Doom an opponent but BS4 is pretty good, so not really needing Guide. Can't hurt tanks tho....

I've not yet used them but I intend to take 10 with Eldrad and park them on an objective, probably behind an Aegis Defence Line. Doom, their target, Guide and Fortune them and they become deadly in shooting and very hard to shift with anything other than template weapons and other stuff that ignores cover.

In 5th ed I would always have made them Pathfinders (well I wouldn't have used them at all as Rangers were rubbish when you could just have more Dire Avengers), but in 6th ed I think I would just leave them as normal Rangers. The only shots that really matter are the ones that you roll 6s to hit with anyway due to precision shot, so becoming AP1 on a 5 as well is a bit irrelevant.

I imagine Pathfinders will get Precision Shot on a 5 as well in their next codex.

Anggul wrote:

The only shots that really matter are the ones that you roll 6s to hit with anyway due to precision shot, so becoming AP1 on a 5 as well is a bit irrelevant.

I'm sorry but why on earth do you discount the usefulness of AP1 shots unless they are precision? Precise shots effectively will only ever take out a special or heavy weapon as characters will just LOS the shot to a grunt. AP1 is still incredibly useful!

Anggul wrote:

In 5th ed I would always have made them Pathfinders (well I wouldn't have used them at all as Rangers were rubbish when you could just have more Dire Avengers), but in 6th ed I think I would just leave them as normal Rangers. The only shots that really matter are the ones that you roll 6s to hit with anyway due to precision shot, so becoming AP1 on a 5 as well is a bit irrelevant.

I imagine Pathfinders will get Precision Shot on a 5 as well in their next codex.

Dont forget they get a bonus +1 to cover saves as well. Count Adhemars idea about the 10 with eldrad is slightly overkill in my opinion. However modify it a little to be: Aegis Def line with pathfinders eldrad on the quad gun with a unit of scatter laser walkers behind it as well, guide the walkers and fortune both squads, and you have a sickening firebase that all has good coversaves too.

Mud

Moved to General Discussion

*takes off mod hat*

my personal oppinion rangers arent good for their point value. Yes, AP1 shots are nice, and yes, Percision shots are even nicer, but in the grand scheme of things killing 4~5 models a game isnt that big of a deal imho. Now if you are taking them for the 1 troop slot for access Allies, or if you are taking them for synergy in an Eldar army, that is fine. Normally you just see them sit on some homebase objective and capture it for you, and thats about it.

As for the upgrade to pathfinders, you might as well take it. I find rangers do nothing, atleast pathfinders are more reliable for damage output...

Count Adhemar wrote:

Anggul wrote:

The only shots that really matter are the ones that you roll 6s to hit with anyway due to precision shot, so becoming AP1 on a 5 as well is a bit irrelevant.

I'm sorry but why on earth do you discount the usefulness of AP1 shots unless they are precision? Precise shots effectively will only ever take out a special or heavy weapon as characters will just LOS the shot to a grunt. AP1 is still incredibly useful!

Because they're terrible at anything other than sniping out weapons. If you want to gun down enemy squads, take something else. Rangers are for Precision, not shooting down random guys with basic weapons, that's what Kabalite Warriors, Dire Avengers and the like are for. Rangers will only kill a few models per game, which is just fine if those models are specific ones you want dead. If they're just random Bolter guys or whatever, you've wasted your points.

Okay so basically pathfinders over rangers are a must if you use them to snipe special weapons. I was planning on taking 5-10 of them either far back in cover or behind an aegis defense line and using them to take out heavy support like BA devastators/ hold objectives. Would they work in this situation or is something else better?

Dark Eldar is typically pretty bad at holding objectives. I don't see how a model can be considered poor if they can hold an objective for you while drawing tons of firepower and last.

Deyfluff wrote:

Okay so basically pathfinders over rangers are a must if you use them to snipe special weapons. I was planning on taking 5-10 of them either far back in cover or behind an aegis defense line and using them to take out heavy support like BA devastators/ hold objectives. Would they work in this situation or is something else better?

Dark Eldar is typically pretty bad at holding objectives. I don't see how a model can be considered poor if they can hold an objective for you while drawing tons of firepower and last.

Well if you're using them to snipe special weapons, being Pathfinders is unnecessary because although you're AP1 on 5+ to hit instead of 6, you still need a 6 for the precision shot. Only make them Pathfinders if you want the extra +1 to their cover save, but personally I think 5pts more each is too much for that. I would rather just spend the points on more models.

Anggul wrote:

Deyfluff wrote:

Okay so basically pathfinders over rangers are a must if you use them to snipe special weapons. I was planning on taking 5-10 of them either far back in cover or behind an aegis defense line and using them to take out heavy support like BA devastators/ hold objectives. Would they work in this situation or is something else better?

Dark Eldar is typically pretty bad at holding objectives. I don't see how a model can be considered poor if they can hold an objective for you while drawing tons of firepower and last.

Well if you're using them to snipe special weapons, being Pathfinders is unnecessary because although you're AP1 on 5+ to hit instead of 6, you still need a 6 for the precision shot. Only make them Pathfinders if you want the extra +1 to their cover save, but personally I think 5pts more each is too much for that. I would rather just spend the points on more models.

The reason for upgrading is to give them the extra cover save, and ignores cover rather than just moves through cover.

In my experience, Pathfinders do one job well - they park an objective like nobody's business. Put five of them on a backfield objective, make sure to get rid of any flamer template nastiness that the enemy might have, and they will sit the entire game, hoping to be unnoticed. As an offensive unit, they really lack the punch - a unit of five averages three hits, one-two wounds. That's pretty weak, honestly, so don't bother going offensive with them - we've got plenty more to cover that. What we don't have are durable point holders, and, as long as the enemy doesn't get into melee or flames them away, Pathfinders will deliver.

Anggul wrote:

Count Adhemar wrote:

Anggul wrote:

The only shots that really matter are the ones that you roll 6s to hit with anyway due to precision shot, so becoming AP1 on a 5 as well is a bit irrelevant.

I'm sorry but why on earth do you discount the usefulness of AP1 shots unless they are precision? Precise shots effectively will only ever take out a special or heavy weapon as characters will just LOS the shot to a grunt. AP1 is still incredibly useful!

Because they're terrible at anything other than sniping out weapons. If you want to gun down enemy squads, take something else. Rangers are for Precision, not shooting down random guys with basic weapons, that's what Kabalite Warriors, Dire Avengers and the like are for. Rangers will only kill a few models per game, which is just fine if those models are specific ones you want dead. If they're just random Bolter guys or whatever, you've wasted your points.

Only just noticed this reply and have to say I disagree. With 36" range and 1/3 shots being AP1 if you're only using them to take out special weapons then you're using them wrong.

Moving this to Slaves and Mercenaries.