1850 with CWE Allies

Hi guys,

My DE list recently capped out at 1250pts & I've been having a blast playing with it.

My regular opponent plays Guard, loves his Tanks & is getting himself a Baneblade for Christmas. His most recent additions were a Valkyrie & Scions.

Local Meta is Tau & SM of all flavours.

So, with a thought towards expanding my list & with a heavy nod towards others on this forum that has influenced my unit selection, I present my theory-crafted 1850. I own all the DE units but would be buying all the CWE models, so this is a thinking before I leap post...

Uneasy Alliance of Necessity 1833

DE HC Grotesquerie 540
Haemonculus, WWP (105) Delivers Fire Dragons
4 x Grots, incl. Abber, Agoniser, Raider, Aethersails (235)
3 x Grots, incl. Abber, Agoniser, Raider, Aethersails (200)

DE CAD 711
Succubus, Glaive, AOM, HWG, WWP (150) Delivers Wraith Guard - tries to join Grots.
3 x 5 Warriors, Cannon Venoms (315)
6 Reavers, 2 x CC (126)
5 x Scourges, HWB (120)

CWE CAD 582
Autarch, Lance, Jetbike, Banshee Mask (100) - Join Reavers
5 x Fire Dragons (110)
5 x Wraith Guard, D-Syches (210)
2 x 3 Windriders, Scatter Lasers (162)

Edited from original to drop 1 Grot in Succ squad & added Lance & sails

I like that my Ob-Sec is very fast & quite shooty, potentially the Scatter Lasers even popping light transports for the Venoms to clean up, either way I see the Venoms & Scatter Bikes hanging together.

Grots will do as Grots do & rush forward looking to start a fight.

Ideally my Reserve Manipulation will allow tactical, reliable threat removal with Scourges, Guard & Fragons dealing with the things I'll having nothing on the board to.

Grouped the Reavers to make the most of the Banshee Mask.

Ideally, the Succubus can deliver the Guard & almost immediately join some nearby Grots, or just get picked up by a now empty Raider etc (If I still have one) to lead any surviving Grots at that point.

Not the most original list I know & it'll only ever see a FLGS event at a stretch, so isn't meant to be hyper competitive. But, it looks real fun to play with, but that's why we all post here, what am I missing?

I think the autarch with just a fusion gun going with the dragons would be more useful than having him on a bike

I vehemently disagree. That makes a six person unit of Reavers absolutely superfluous and isn't worth the price reduction from a Farseer.

Instead I believe no matter what else you consider, such as swapping the succubus for an AoM blaster archon instead of planning on swapping to the grotesques, that you should drop 1 base grotesque from each unit. This way even if you do attach a character you'll still get rampage against 5 person squads.

I think the best use of the points you just freed up is the shard of anaris on the autarch, take an arena champion in the reaver squad and give them one of the CC's. This is absolutely legal as the CC and grav-talon make no distinction about squad member's model name unlike the blaster, and allows you to either scare off their tie-up characters in the fight or place a str6 rending bomb at their feet with the Autarch taking all the real challenges. In this configuration I'm partial to making the Arena Champion my warlord for a personal trait, or even rolling on DE since it's basically a CC trait chart.

With the remaining pts I'd take 2 shock prows on the grotesque's raiders.

Hi guys,

Thanks to you both for your replies & also wanted to point out that I seemed to have missed a unit of Warriors off when I posted, just corrected my original.

Nice to know that I didn't get 'Blasted' for bad picks which is always nice

@amorrowlyday - I agree that my potentially biggest waste of points is possible in the Succubus, I may look to rework her, or drop for a cheaper WWP.

If I do drop her though, then I would definitely look to keep the 4 man Grot. squads, but use the extra points for Aethersails on the Grot Raiders & a Lance on the Autarch.

Archon Variation:

Uneasy Alliance of Necessity 1848
DE HC Grotesquerie 575
Haemonculus, WWP (105) Delivers Wraith Guard
2 x 4 Grots, incl. Abbers, Agonisers, Raiders, Aethersails (470)

DE CAD 691
Archon, Blaster, AOM, HWG, WWP (130) Delivers Fire Dragons
3 x 5 Warriors, Cannon Venoms (315)
6 Reavers, 2 x CC (126)
5 x Scourges, HWB (120)

CWE CAD 582
Autarch, Jetbike, Banshee Mask, Lance (100) - Join Reavers
5 x Fire Dragons (110)
5 x Wraith Guard, D-Syches (210)
2 x 3 Windriders, Scatter Lasers (162)

So, I guess, A or B?

Hmm, this is perhaps the only time I have ever NOT screamed about blaster archons. Weird. Anyway, please dont let the Succi go without a thought. That AP2 really comes in handy at times.

Something to note about the jetbike autarch: he doesnt have fleet. So if you join it in a unit of DE Reavers, they will loose fleet too. However, the swooping hawk wings DO allow him to keep fleet.

Just saying.

fisheyes wrote:

Anyway, please dont let the Succi go without a thought. That AP2 really comes in handy at times.

Hi, I did like the idea of the Succubus, but I am concerned that if she has to WWP away from the Grots, she will then be just wasted where she is. IF I can get her to the Grots, or even manage to WWP right in next to some convenient Grots, then she should be viable......

As mentioned in my original though, I own all the DE units in both lists, so could take either, just wanted to check I wasn't going to go & buy a expensive pile of CWE models that I would not use.

Since the biggest argueing point is the load out of the Autarch, I'm pretty happy

Now just to work out the best way to buy them.

The Start Collecting Bundle is pretty pointless, just hoping the new Battle Force contains some useful things, otherwise it will be standard GW price less 25% from my favourite Indi. dealer.

Rewind wrote:

The Start Collecting Bundle is pretty pointless, just hoping the new Battle Force contains some useful things, otherwise it will be standard GW price less 25% from my favourite Indi. dealer.

So sadly not DE or CWE Battleforce for Christmas

Ok, so more thinking while @ work

Option C - Iyanden Allies

Iyanden Allied Detachment 490
Spiritseer (70)
Autarch, Jetbike, Banshee Mask, Lance (100)
5 x Fire Dragons (110)
5 x Wraith Guard, Scythes (210)

Basically drops Scatter bikes for a Spiritseer, giving me a little psychic protection & freeing up some more points.

The previous CWE CAD could also be dropped to a Allied Detachment of course, by dropping 1 Scatterbike squad.

I kinda prefer the Iyanden allies, as Scatterbikes were only in there, because I needed troop choices. I know they are actually really good, but would prefer for DE than CWE, especially when 1 Spiritseer is cash wise, cheaper than 2 Windrider boxes

Full List assuming List A:

Succubus, Glaive, AOM, HWG, WWP - Delivers Wraithguard, Joins Grots
3 x 5 Warriors, Cannon Venoms
6 x Reavers, CC - Autarch here
3 x Reavers, CC
5 x Scourges, HWB

Haemonculus, WWP - Delivers Fire Dragons
2 x 4 Grots, Incl. Abber, Agoniser, Raiders, Aethersails

Spiritseer - No idea where this would go?
Autarch, Jetbike, Lance, BM
5 x Wraith Guard, Scythes
5 x Fire Dragons

1839, so still 11 points to play with & would appreciate recommendations?

Also, where do you put the Spiritseer? With Guard & Succubus?

I personally prefer this list, based on favourite models & fluff etc, but it lacks the many Venoms my normal thinking would have be bring. The guard do now have Ob. Sec. though.

Would love feedback, on any of the 3 posts so far lol

Again: if you're putting IC's in units of grotesques there is no real benefit to the 4th body since your basically paying 35 points to trade 3-9 attacks, 1-3 being ap3, for 4 attacks and 3 more wounds in most cases. At best you're paying 12pts per wound for 3 more wounds and on a 3+ rampage roll it was significantly more costly.

I'd probably stick the Spiritseer into the spare grot squad with any of your formulations if I was playing ITC, or in a community that doesn't use the FAQ's yet.

Yeah sorry, I got so carried away with the 3rd option I forgot to consider your points for the Succubus list.

If I ran List A, I would definitely drop 1 grot. & then send the full Raider straight at a target, but the smaller squad to where the Succubus will be, assuming my reserve manipulation works out.

With the extra 35, Lance on the Autarch & Aethersails on the Raiders & a few to play with.

Edited the OP to reflect improvements.

I ran a list very similar to your proposed concept, at least in that it had a D-Scythe Wraithguard and Fire Dragons arriving by Webway Portals. I had a Wraithknight instead of the Grotesquerie. If you want to check out the details, here is a link to my list and battle reports.

Part of the reason I took Wraithguard was I was expecting to face lots of Knights or other big stuff. In the end I faced Knights in three of the five tournament games I played. If you don't face Gargantuan or Superheavies the Wraithguard plus portal bearer come to 360 points and you could replace them with a wide variety of options, such as 3 squads of Haywire Blaster Scourges if you really want to deal with armour. The other issue with Wraithguard is the deep strike rules against many units limit your ability to hit with all templates when you land.

I went with a minimal cost WWP bearer for the Fire Dragons with an Archon with Haywire Grenades and WWP. Because the Fire Dragons want to be within 6" to get their melta bonus, you don't really need the Blaster as you are in range to throw the grenade.

I had a Succubus with the Wraithguard, and the only game she was useful was against Eldar where a squad of Banshees charged the Wraithguard, so no overwatch was available. It's pretty rare for the character in that squad to be needed for melee duty. I also usually had a Farseer with Invisibility on the squad, which made it more of a mini death star.

Unless you expect to face lots of big stuff where the Wraithguard are crucial, I would be tempted to go Grotesquerie with Haemonculus WWP bearer for Fire Dragons, and drop the Wraithguard. That would give you options of switching the Eldar to an Aspect Host, or adding in more Scatter Lasers to deal with the light armour that Dark Eldar struggle with.

The concept that you have can work nicely, and is fun to play.

Fisheyes - just an FYI - Reavers don't have Fleet, so no issue with adding an Autarch without it.

@ Kantalla

Thanks man, some really usefull advise there.

I'll take a look through your reports & try to learn a few lessons.

Think I've decided I'm going to give something like this a go, should make a fun change from the usual Venom spam I tend to run.