Bringing CW Eldar as allies

Hey Dark City!

So I'm working on a Dark Eldar/ Eldar army list for some campaigns that are coming up, but I have so far had no luck with my CW Eldar in any of my battles (something like 5 consecutive loses). So I'm even more stumped when running them with DE. I have my usual 1000 pts Dark Eldar list and I'm looking for 500-1000 points of CW Eldar to add to this. I would not be apposed to getting some more Eldar if it is things i don't have yet, but ill list what i own so far at the bottom of my DE list. Usually, I run my 1000pts of Eldar like this...

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HQ
Archon +Combat Drugs +Powersword = 85pts

Elites
4 Kabalite Trueborn +4 Blasters +Venom + SC = 173pts

Troops
20 Warriors + 2 Raiders +FF = 320pts

10 Wyches +Raider +FF = 170pts

Fast Attack
7 Hellions+ 1 Helliarch+ Powersword = 143pts

Heavy Support
Ravager +FF = 115pts

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I think that is how I usually run them. As for Eldar, I have 20 Guardians, 10 Dire, 6 Banshees, 3 Warlocks, 1 Farseer, 3 Dark Reapers, 5 Rangers, 1 Wraithlord, 1 Falcon.

So any help would be great
Thanks Dark City!
Cheers

easy, use what works in the Eldar Codex. so that equals= Farseer, Jetseer, Seer Council, Guardian Jetbikes, Fire Dragons, and War Walkers. Out of the codex those are the best they have. Some things can be said about the Wraithlord and all falcon chassis vehicles, but those normally need a list built around them. Also if you can get your hands on some, hornets are the sauce... check out IA 11 for them (they can be used by Codex Eldar army too)

Basically you need to define a roll for your Allies. This is their purpose and their job is to only do that. You then build around that and add in what is needed. Say you want some melta in your army, then a squad of 5 fire dragons and a wave serpent are needed. Oh, and you might as well add in a farseer on jetbike w/ runes of warding for some twin linking dark lances (through divination primaris power) and psychic defense. Add in 3 GJB and you have yourself a durable cheap and fast scouring unit.

Alright, when then i guess my next question is what role do my Eldar need to fill? Between my Trueborn, Haywires on wyches (forgot to include them in pricing) and Ravager I feel confident with my anti-vehicle, My raiders all have Disintegrator Cannons for power armour, and all the Kabalites and Venom shots make up most of my mass-infantry-firepower. Everything about DE pretty much fills a Fast Attack role.

Edit: Maybe some sort of Elite/HQ hunter?

Well, a 1000 pts Eldar/Dark Eldar list of mine usually looks something like this (just gonna eyeball it because don't have a codex with me)

Close combat Archon warlord

Two squads of Warriors with Splinter Cannons in boats with Flickerfields

Jetseer
Five Pathfinders
Wraithlord with EML, two flamers, Wraithsword

The Eldar detachment is time-proved to be very good at distracting the enemy, while also remaining dangerous if left unchecked. The Wraithlord slowly footslogs through the very center of the table to draw as much fire as possible (and wrecks stuff dead if he doesn't get focused down), Farseer amplifies Wraithlord/ Kabalites, Pathfinders sit on a point, preferably somewhere high in ruins all game long, trying to be as invisible as possible. Really, the Dark Eldar half can look like anything you want, you got about 600 points which allows for a few Venoms or Raiders worth of stuff.

I must also say that our local metagame sees little vehicular action in this edition, most of the people field mainly footslog lists with some Heavy Support vehicles.

Farseer is the main reason to take Eldar allies, as he provides us with something we othervise severely lack (psykers and psychic defence). Rangers or Jetbikes are a relatively cheap and pretty good troop choise (since you need one troop choise). Warp Spiders and Warwalkers are also pretty good (Warwalkers with shuricannons are actually very cheap, unlike nearly everything else in the codex). To be honest, I don't think Dragons are that good as allies. They lack a good deployment mechanism and you can only have one unit as allies. They will blow up any vehicles if they get close, but it's hard to get them close enough and they will die the next turn. It's not that we really lack ways to deal with heavy armour. Warwalkers and Warp Spiders have multiple shot medium strenght weapons that are good at dealing with medium and light armour (ie. Chimeras and Razorbacks).

ok, first lets look at your DE side of the list and lets do some changes

First off your HQ: The only reason to take an archon is to take his toys, namely the shadowfield. There is no reason to not run a archon without one (unless you are one of those weirdos that like ths clonefield ) if you want to run a cheap HQ, get a haemie or a Succubus.

Secondly while a power sword is normally nice, being only S3 hurts him a great deal. I would suggest figure out what you want your archon to do, and build him to fit that role. Right now he has no defense and no offense, and is just there for the HQ slot. I you want that, just get a haemie. Its cheaper.

TB are fine, but if you need the points you could always just run 3 instead

Warriors are fine, but I would suggest get some special weapons in there (mostly blasters and splinter cannons) to make use of those gunboats. atleast get some splinter racks in there so that they get re-rolls on all those rifles.

As for the wyches. Get a Hekatrix in there with atleast a venomblade and PGL. The hekatrix adds a leadership pip which is important in case they get shot out of the sky, and the venom blade is a cheap alternative to a power weapon for damage output. The PGL is for the stealth effect of defensive grenades, and allow them to surivive the charge and get throw even the worse overwatch (unless they are flamers ofc) its a very good use of 10 points.

Hellions are a joke unless you use them in connection with Baron. Them by themselves arent worth their points, and you should just get another warrior squad if you want shooting, or another wych squad if you want assault.


Ok... now to the allies. Looking at your list now you need some more long range AT imho. So lets start with the Falcon. Give it a scatter or EML and underslug Surri Cannon, and you got yourself a decent gun platform, if not only BS3 platform. To mitigate that you can take a Farseer w/ 1 power and drop it for the primaris power in divination (re-roll to hits in shooting and close combat) You might as well throw in RoW as well for some psyker defense as well. Now we need a troop, and that can easily be DAVU (5 DA). Now throw both the farseer and DAs in the Falcon, and you got yourself a decent gun platform w/ a scoring unit that can get out late game and score an objective.

Shadows Revenge wrote:

The only reason to take an archon is to take his toys

Agreed 100%. Archons are IMO the kings of going all out. Shell out the points for the good stuff (Shadow Field at the very least though you might as well buy more) or don't bring him. If you want a fighting HQ the Succubus will be cheaper and better then an Archon who isn't kitted out and the Haemo will generally do the cheap shooting duties the best with a Liquifier.

Anyway, as for the Eldar allies: To me the main (and maybe only) thing Eldar bring to Dark Eldar is the Farseer. Anything else (Anti-Tank, Anti-Infantry, ect...) can be done pretty much as well with DE troops. As such most Eldar allies I see are a Farseer with various amounts of equipment and a minimalist troop choice (Rangers/Jetbikes being the norm). If you really wan more then Warwalkers are the only other things that stand out to me.

Going by the models you've listed then, I personally would only field the Farseer and the 5 rangers. Put the Farseer with the rangers (or a warrior squad) and you're set.

Thank you everyone for the suggestions and keep them coming! I will outfit my Archon so he packs more of a punch, and i may drop the Hellions for something different, more wyches maybe?. I would for sure bring the Farseer, cause the psychic powers would be useful. Rangers sound good, The DA and Farseer in the Falcon, maybe some Warp Spiders because i like the models, and I'm also thinking Converting up some corsairs? They would be fast enough to keep up with the Dark Eldar while foot slogging.

I started writing this bit on Eldrad and deathstar units but I'll just post a link from here as it's relevant to this but I wanted to start it as a new thread. http://www.thedarkcity.net/t4647-de-ally-eldrad-and-his-death-stars#52235

I highly recommend you give your Archon a blaster if he is going to roll with your Blasterborn, and Shadowfield, Venom blade is a good CC weapon, one of my favorites because of cost to gain ratio.