Idea Fixing Wyches

I agree, but the beast movement on the talos might be a bit too much. That thing doesn't look like a fast beast...

CptMetal wrote:

I agree, but the beast movement on the talos might be a bit too much. That thing doesn't look like a fast beast...

In all fairness, nor does this:



At least our army is supposed to be fast...

Plus, our monsters are clearly fitted with an anti-grav device, so no reason why they couldn't be fast.

Erebus wrote:

Plus, our monsters are clearly fitted with an anti-grav device, so no reason why they couldn't be fast.

You got a point there.

Erebus wrote:

Plus, our monsters are clearly fitted with an anti-grav device, so no reason why they couldn't be fast.

This is a major pet peeve of mine.  The talos has always been on a flying base, but has never been able to move faster than infantry on foot.  I don't know of any other GW model on that kind of base, which is also limited to 6" movement.

And remember we're the fast army.

I do think it's particularly funny that we all pretty much agree that they can't make the book any worse, so almost any change would be welcome.
I guess we'll see in a few year - after chaos marines, daemons, orks, and tyranids all get their power boosts.

I'm betting forgeworld updates their corsairs list twice (and keeps up with the power creep) before Geedubs puts out a new dark eldar book (to address their own terrible design).

Chaos Marines will not be done before 2017.... :-(

Erebus wrote:

Plus, our monsters are clearly fitted with an anti-grav device, so no reason why they couldn't be fast.

Because we're not loved by GW. If we had power armor we'd be fast

Devilogical wrote:

Erebus wrote:

Plus, our monsters are clearly fitted with an anti-grav device, so no reason why they couldn't be fast.

You got a point there.

"The elegant dunestriders of the adeptus mechanicus strode swiftly through the battlefield, evading the cumbersome war machines of the dark eldar. Here a Sydonian dragoon danced out of reach of the lumbering Talos's wild swings while delivering precise lance thrusts in return..."

From where this quote?

Just made it up to poke fun at how we've got an edition of 40k where the Adeptus Mechanicus has swift finesse walkers compared to the slow and armored monsters of the Dark Eldar.

They should at least have fleet...

HokutoAndy wrote:

Just made it up to poke fun at how we've got an edition of 40k where the Adeptus Mechanicus has swift finesse walkers compared to the slow and armored monsters of the Dark Eldar.

Ruststalkers certainly made me raise my eyebrows.

4 attacks each on the charge, S4, pseudo-rending in the first round of combat and AP2 in subsequent rounds, Furious Charge, Haywire on every model.

Most importantly though, they add 3" to all move, run and charge distances.

Like banshee or clowns?

give wyches a rerollable 5+ all the time thats increased to 4+ in the fight phase. To represent agility and dodgyness ;p

Why rerollable? Why not Stealth and shrouded and a straight forward 4 ++ in close combat? Stealth and shrouded to represent that they are just able to dodge anything. But that doesn't fix the Cannon part of the glass Cannon. I actually prefer to increase their punch

CptMetal wrote:

Why rerollable? Why not Stealth and shrouded and a straight forward 4 ++ in close combat? Stealth and shrouded to represent that they are just able to dodge anything.

Or, as I said before; Jink. A nice, simple and even fluffy way to get a 4+ save against enemy fire (except flamers), at arguably not much of a cost.

Btw, Stealth means hiding from the enemy, Shrouded pretty much carrying some form of cover around with you.

CptMetal wrote:

But that doesn't fix the Cannon part of the glass Cannon. I actually prefer to increase their punch

True. Something to get through armor is necessary, even if it's only a special weapon.
At least Bloodbrides should be able to take power weapons or agonizers instead of only Wych Cult weapons. There's a reason why they used to be called Hekatrix Bloodbrides: Each one of them is supposedly a Hekatrix!

Banshees are the same statline as wyches but are immune to overwatch, have AP3 power weapons, +3 run/charge range, and 4+ armor. That makes each of those differences less than 1 point upgrades. We just need to make these upgrades available to wyches at double that point cost each(2/wych) and we'll be cool.

In before someone mentions S3 with power weapons: We eventually get furious charge. On wyches with 2 point power weapons, I can wait for it.



EDIT: Just thought about this: Bloodbrides are actually the SAME price as banshees, while being the same slot(elite) and worse in every way.



ALTERNATIVE TAKE: Or if people don't want wyches to be good at killing things, make them our version of guardsmen. Make them 6 points per model with their current statlines, gear and upgrade options, except able to be taken in squads of up to 20-25.

Oh, that would be nice too! A blob of witches to drown the enemy in!

When they'd try to fix witches with such a formation, what would you consider good?

CptMetal wrote:

When they'd try to fix witches with such a formation, what would you consider good?

Formation rules usually take what the units are already good at to the next level, instead of allowing them do things they wouldn't normally. For our current Wyches, of course, that doesn't mean a lot.
A Wych horde meant to tarpit enemies could get re-rollable Dodge saves and the option to take more than 3 special weapons in 20-man squads, I guess.

A good general Wych formation/detachment rule though would be the ability to choose their Combat Drugs, or at least to roll a second die and pick one result, like Duke Sliscus used to do.

It's always something with an HQ model. Maybe like:

During each of the players movement phases in which a unit of this formation is in close combat and in 18 inches of the succubus, it may roll for one additional drug. Discard results already used.

Formation: The Termination Tango (Sorry, not willing to do more research for a more appropriate name at the moment.)

While any unit of wyches from this formation is within 18" of the succubus from this formation, they may use their dodge invuln save against wounds inflicted in any game phase, and add 3 inches to their run and charge distances.

When we played Kill team campaing, we was able to create our own Special characters with rules, wargear etc. So my succubus gives all wyches and bloodbrides in the inspiring zone Hit-and-run, abylity to charge when making hit-and-run or consolidation, and every platoon roll for they own drug effect. She cost me 130 pts. Maybe we should have some formation like this?

As for fluff, my wych cult arrive on planet to make a competition: the surviving wyches would have chance to become bloodbrides, called Harpyes.

Give them the old ability to jump from one close combat too another? Interesting but that doesn't help if the are fragile and weak or am I missing something?

CptMetal wrote:

Give them the old ability to jump from one close combat too another?

That would mean they'd actually have to win a combat though.