We lost fire and fade. And if I'm just tripping and we do have units with asuryani (Which I'm fairly sure we don't), we lost it for aircraft, so no invincible planes...
*Page 119 – Stratagems, Fire and Fade Change the first sentence to read: ‘You can use this Stratagem after an Asuryani unit from your army (excluding Aircraft) shoots in the Shooting phase.’
man i was hoping we would at least keep that, it was pretty fluffy for a plane to fly over shoot and disapear but NOOOOOOOOO we can have untargetable invincible dreads raining down 4 lascannon shots per round but a plane that cannot be targeted using a fluffy stratagem is too OP...
Anyway not that it wont get changed as well but as it stands aircraft are still unchargable right?
krayd Hekatrix
Posts : 1343 Join date : 2011-10-03 Location : Richmond, VA
Anyway not that it wont get changed as well but as it stands aircraft are still unchargable right?
I don't think that anyone *actually* believes that we lost Fire and Fade.
Technically, aircraft are still unchargeable. The datasheet says that they can only be attacked in close combat by units with FLY. However, the core rules state that no unit (FLY or otherwise) can end any kind of move, except for a pile-in or heroic intervention, within engagement range of AIRCRAFT, so RAW, planes are unchargeable.
We lost fire and fade. And if I'm just tripping and we do have units with asuryani (Which I'm fairly sure we don't), we lost it for aircraft, so no invincible planes...
*Page 119 – Stratagems, Fire and Fade Change the first sentence to read: ‘You can use this Stratagem after an Asuryani unit from your army (excluding Aircraft) shoots in the Shooting phase.’
That is a typo, I'm pretty sure. Copy and pasted from the other FAQs.
Drukhari do still have the advantage of Raiding Party. People dismiss it, but it is a massive bonus to be able to bring 3 different traits for 0 CP cost. Of course, how effective each component will be remains to be seen.
I am not sure we want to run 10-man squads because blasts will just wreck them. This kind of makes Wyches really bad, since they were only really decent in 10-man squads before IMO. Even flocks went up! I may have to shelve my Drukhari for a while and just play Harlequins and Guard until the True Kin get their new codex.
Here is my dogshit taco attempt at a list, I think it may be a handful of points over even... *sigh*
Black Heart Patrol Archon (Warlord, Writ, Splinter Pistol, Huskblade) 5 Warriors with Shredder Venom 2x Ravagers with Disintegrators
Black Heart Patrol Archon (Huskblade Splinter Pistol, PGL) 5 Warriors with Shredder Venom Raider with Dark Lance (for second archon and Wyches) 2x Reapers
Custom Cult (Slashing Impact, Test of Skill) Succubus with hydra gauntlets, +Strength, PGL (can she take this, can't remember) 5x Wyches with Shardnet and Impaler, +Movement 6x Reavers with 2 blasters, grav talons, +Toughness 6x Reavers with 2 blasters, grav talons, +Attack 2x Razorwings with Disintegrators
I gotta laugh though, I got banned from the Facebook Drukhari group for saying Cronos are crap... and they are even more crap now. Hilarious.
Void lance is 0 though, and IMO was always the better weapon since it's S9.
Not with Test of Skill. Dark Scythes wounds T7 and lower on 2s anyway. Void lances were only (slightly) better at T8 and T9. Dark Scythes at T10+ again.
Yeah, but Void Lances only kill 1 Primaris each. Dark Scythes would be 6 shots against a unit of 6 or more.
Eh, i don't expect too many 6+ man units among elite armies, they have very little to gain from that.
Also many of them are rocking 3 wounds now (eradicators, blade guard, etc.)
sekac wrote:
Crucible of Sorrow wrote:
Void lance is 0 though, and IMO was always the better weapon since it's S9.
Not with Test of Skill. Dark Scythes wounds T7 and lower on 2s anyway. Void lances were only (slightly) better at T8 and T9. Dark Scythes at T10+ again.
Fair point, but there is no way I am paying over 200 points for a Void Bomber. I probably just won't use it at all (since patrols only allow 2 fliers anyway...)
I am shocked by the nearly 40% increase for voidravens. They lost more than they gained and are significantly more expensive.
Voidravens went up 20 Points and thats it?
You pay 20 points per dark scythe now too.
Nah, it looks like it's 185 for the full package; both Void Lances and Scythes are 0, as are all missiles: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-orE6HSrv3zYnI5UfXgctcSuezpLf7fK8F_8nR1M2KA/htmlview#
I am shocked by the nearly 40% increase for voidravens. They lost more than they gained and are significantly more expensive.
Voidravens went up 20 Points and thats it?
You pay 20 points per dark scythe now too.
Nah, it looks like it's 185 for the full package; both Void Lances and Scythes are 0, as are all missiles: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-orE6HSrv3zYnI5UfXgctcSuezpLf7fK8F_8nR1M2KA/htmlview#
So now the question is which leak is right? I hope the one you presented.
Venoms are losing hard this edition. And there are many more than questionable point hikes across our book (Haywire Scourges went up 25% WTF).
Many options took a 15-20 percent increase (including transports etc.). I think the Voidraven will be useful while Razorwings are dead in the water. 195pts for 2 Disintegrator Cannons on a flier? Over my dead body.
I liked Red Grief + Flayed Skull in 8th, but 9th seems to force us further into the archetypical Black Hand + Prophest of Flesh list. Taloi are still affordable and six of them in a PoF Patrol are more than enough. And Wracks are the only troops that won't get blasted from the board instantly.
Btw: Wracks and Kabalites in a Dark Lance Raider cost 20% more and Wyches even 25% more. I'm glad they finally nerfed our Wyches, they clearly dominated the meta and never got shot to pieces.
Why anybody would competitively take Wych Cults now is beyond me. Hellions and Wyches are stupidly overpriced and it's not worth for Reavers alone. I'd rather take more Coven stuff.
Disintegrator Ravagers cost 15% more and lost what made it great in last edition. But it seems they will be needed more than ever.
I'm surprised this edition should be about Necrons, everything seems geared towards the Primaris show. I haven't looked at them in detail, but there is no way that our beloved Spess Mahreens are anywhere near the 20% price hike. It's another case of GW just having no clue what they were doing, or caring. Probably both.
Those are my takeaways after doing lots of number crunching. I already had a bad feeling with our faction preview (you know, from the "Aeldari Exprt" guy who was only known for playing Craftworlds). Whoever this guy is, he lost all credibility for calling Reavers "key units".
Note: I'm doing game design and RTS balance as a hobby and I've worked with several mod/community projects over many years. I see those changes as a semi-professional insult. A random number generator would have done a better job.
I'm glad they finally nerfed our Wyches, they clearly dominated the meta and never got shot to pieces.
Why anybody would competitively take Wych Cults now is beyond me. Hellions and Wyches are stupidly overpriced and it's not worth for Reavers alone. I'd rather take more Coven stuff.
My hope is that with this edition's emphasis on positioning and lack of automatic Overwatch Wych Cults will come out ok. Red Grief seems like an automatic choice at this point.
Venoms are losing hard this edition. And there are many more than questionable point hikes across our book (Haywire Scourges went up 25% WTF).
Many options took a 15-20 percent increase (including transports etc.). I think the Voidraven will be useful while Razorwings are dead in the water. 195pts for 2 Disintegrator Cannons on a flier? Over my dead body.
175 for Razorwings with two cannons, but I get your point.
There will be another re-balance a couple of weeks after the Space Marine codex comes out and they wreck everyone's face for the first month or two of this edition (and then continue wrecking face just not as much).
Venoms are losing hard this edition. And there are many more than questionable point hikes across our book (Haywire Scourges went up 25% WTF).
Many options took a 15-20 percent increase (including transports etc.). I think the Voidraven will be useful while Razorwings are dead in the water. 195pts for 2 Disintegrator Cannons on a flier? Over my dead body.
I liked Red Grief + Flayed Skull in 8th, but 9th seems to force us further into the archetypical Black Hand + Prophest of Flesh list. Taloi are still affordable and six of them in a PoF Patrol are more than enough. And Wracks are the only troops that won't get blasted from the board instantly.
Btw: Wracks and Kabalites in a Dark Lance Raider cost 20% more and Wyches even 25% more. I'm glad they finally nerfed our Wyches, they clearly dominated the meta and never got shot to pieces.
Why anybody would competitively take Wych Cults now is beyond me. Hellions and Wyches are stupidly overpriced and it's not worth for Reavers alone. I'd rather take more Coven stuff.
Disintegrator Ravagers cost 15% more and lost what made it great in last edition. But it seems they will be needed more than ever.
I'm surprised this edition should be about Necrons, everything seems geared towards the Primaris show. I haven't looked at them in detail, but there is no way that our beloved Spess Mahreens are anywhere near the 20% price hike. It's another case of GW just having no clue what they were doing, or caring. Probably both.
Those are my takeaways after doing lots of number crunching. I already had a bad feeling with our faction preview (you know, from the "Aeldari Exprt" guy who was only known for playing Craftworlds). Whoever this guy is, he lost all credibility for calling Reavers "key units".
Note: I'm doing game design and RTS balance as a hobby and I've worked with several mod/community projects over many years. I see those changes as a semi-professional insult. A random number generator would have done a better job.
Point of order: Razorwing looks to be 170. 120+25+25. Obviously, it is safe to use your splinter cannon piece as a toothpick at this point though.
Otherwise, I agree with you overall.
I am excited about the potential of DT Talos and Chronos right now. The Chronos is the same cost as far as I can tell. Maybe 10 points more, but being able to fire that spirit syphon in close combat is really good. Auto-hitting with str 3, +1 to wound, AP-2, D2 and D3+1 damage on 5s is really deadly. Talos twin-liquifiers (which got much cheaper) are great for the same reason.
If people charge our monsters and don't kill them, they'll get blown off the table--likely in our own shooting phase. If there's anything in charge range afterwards, go for it.
I am shocked by the nearly 40% increase for voidravens. They lost more than they gained and are significantly more expensive.
Voidravens went up 20 Points and thats it?
You pay 20 points per dark scythe now too.
Nah, it looks like it's 185 for the full package; both Void Lances and Scythes are 0, as are all missiles: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1-orE6HSrv3zYnI5UfXgctcSuezpLf7fK8F_8nR1M2KA/htmlview#
So now the question is which leak is right? I hope the one you presented.
That one is sourced from this, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQY932e6hN4
Which is SS82 (eldar player) reading off from his advanced copy lol.
Note: I'm doing game design and RTS balance as a hobby and I've worked with several mod/community projects over many years. I see those changes as a semi-professional insult. A random number generator would have done a better job.
How you feel about that Venom Blade costing the same as Huskblade?
I’m thinking that Incubi come out ahead from these point changes.
Incubi put out a high amount of attacks at good AP and can potentially inflict multi-wound damage. Seeing as most of the Cult units became pretty unusable, they’re likely one of the strongest melee infantry unit we have. The only other things that I think serve a similar role better would be the Talos with Macro Scalpels, but with a Raider transport they’re more mobile. I don’t really see Disintegrator Spam as a viable option at the moment because paying +20 points on Ravagers, +15 Points on Raiders and around +15 points on the Warrior units inside the Raiders in an edition which seems to place a heavy emphasis on holding/storming objectives...
Now, they’re still not good compared Assault Intercessors which are substantially tougher, put out more attacks, and get their faction benefit. But compared to our own units, they’re pretty good. Before you could get two Warriors for every Incubi and have a couple points left over. I’m going to try and forget what our points used to be () and hopefully something good comes out of this edition!
I’m going to try and add in 15 Incubi between two Raiders with Dark Lances backed by Drazhar as my fragile glass hammer. (As soon as the global pandemic allows ). Hopefully they do well backed by some Talos, Ravagers and Venoms!
PS. Not new to the Dark Kin, but new to the site! Hope you’re all well given the circumstances!
I am an outsider looking in to the faction but I think the troop points going up makes sense thematically, which seems to be how GW envisions and balances their game. Eldar of any flavor probably shouldn't be run in huge numbers and Dark Eldar's niche always seemed to be as super fast and effective killing machines.
In an edition where people have to hold Objectives til their turn starts having the hitting power to kill all the other guys stuff every turn and the mobility to zip around the board to take last second points seems like it might work in the the armies favor. I'm hoping in the next codex GW doubles down on the killing power of Drukhari to balance out the more elite model count if they can make that work.
I know I have been eyeballing these gorgeous models for years now and the downright reasonable (by GW standards) dollar to point ratio means I finally plan to jump in and try the army out for 9th ed.
Subject: Re: 40k 9th Editon 
Mon Jul 13 2020, 21:26
) and hopefully something good comes out of this edition! 
