Apparently... we're next.

That seems more reasonable to me. At the very least we need something to counter psychic powers, which I expect we will get. I just wouldn't count on anything else to make up for having no psykers. It's not like other psykerless armies like ad mech have anything to replace psykers so I wouldn't count on it for us either.

Lord Asvaldir wrote:

That seems more reasonable to me. At the very least we need something to counter psychic powers, which I expect we will get. I just wouldn't count on anything else to make up for having no psykers. It's not like other psykerless armies like ad mech have anything to replace psykers so I wouldn't count on it for us either.

And the Tau

The "no psykers" thing serves two important things in the lore, and thus the concept of the army. First, it helps distinguish us from Craftworlders. It's clear that when the Dark Eldar were originally created, it was a priority that they not just be Craftworld Eldar with spikes. Second, it reinforces the True Kin's relationship with She Who Thirsts. Dark Eldar don't have psykers because for using them would risk getting eaten by Slaanesh, especially since they live in the Webway.

I don't have a problem with armies not having things. If every army was good at everything, it would be a less interesting game.

That said, the ways the Dark Eldar lore has been represented in the past hasn't been great. They may no longer have psykers, but they're physically more dangerous than their Craftworld cousins (not represented in game), and they have technology that allows them to view enemy psykers as "amusing playthings" (not represented in game).

dumpeal wrote:

Lord Asvaldir wrote:

That seems more reasonable to me. At the very least we need something to counter psychic powers, which I expect we will get. I just wouldn't count on anything else to make up for having no psykers. It's not like other psykerless armies like ad mech have anything to replace psykers so I wouldn't count on it for us either.

And the Tau

I didn't mention Tau or Necrons because they don't have codexes yet, so haven't gotten artifacts/stratagems to deal with psykers or special abilities to make up for not having psykers. Again I would count on at least Necrons having a method for dealing with psykers, but Tau for sure are not going to get anything to replace psykers. Necrons might get more C'tan powers which kinda makes up for it.

As far as our own army goes, all I really want is enough anti-psyker stuff to deal with not having them, both from artifacts and stratagems. Power from pain has always kinda what I expect to represent dark eldar being "physically stronger". Better tech doesn't really bother me either, our weapons are cool and will all be good as long as we get an appropriate price reduction (so a big one for most weapons). Ideally yeah I'd like poison to be redone but I just don't think that's a realistic expectation.

I do kind of want us to get psykers, if only because an Eldar faction without them has always felt a bit wrong to me and the lore now sort of supports it.

I'd settle for more anti-psyker stuff in general, though.

Lord Asvaldir wrote:

That seems more reasonable to me. At the very least we need something to counter psychic powers, which I expect we will get. I just wouldn't count on anything else to make up for having no psykers. It's not like other psykerless armies like ad mech have anything to replace psykers so I wouldn't count on it for us either.

Ad-mech get canticles.. Tau get marklights and rules like supporting fire and the buffs provided by a fire blade or etheral

Burnage wrote:

I do kind of want us to get psykers, if only because an Eldar faction without them has always felt a bit wrong to me and the lore now sort of supports it.

I'd settle for more anti-psyker stuff in general, though.

Here, a psycker. Everybody, get him! I want a new nightmare doll.

I agree that we should not get Psykers, but I could be tempted with "psyker-like" units. The Haemonculi are known to have devices and knowledge that border on magic. And the Mandrakes too, could potentially have powers that act different, yet similar to the ones from the Warp (Mandrake HQ?).

I simply think some active abilities would pair well with our army and enhance synergies.
I wonder, is the dislike towards psykers more rooted to fluff or the gameplay too? Because there are many ways to give us psyker-like effects without having actual psykers.

The Strange Dark One wrote:

I agree that we should not get Psykers, but I could be tempted with "psyker-like" units. The Haemonculi are known to have devices and knowledge that border on magic. And the Mandrakes too, could potentially have powers that act different, yet similar to the ones from the Warp (Mandrake HQ?).

I simply think some active abilities would pair well with our army and enhance synergies.
I wonder, is the dislike towards psykers more rooted to fluff or the gameplay too? Because there are many ways to give us psyker-like effects without having actual psykers.

I think it's mostly fluff, but it reflect in the gameplay. If every faction that don't use psy use their own psy-like abilities that only use a different name, but have the same game effect, you'll lose that flavour. When 7th started, they miss their chance of making power from pain to works with pain tokens in a pain pool and be used by haemonculus just like psy points.

lament.config wrote:

Lord Asvaldir wrote:

That seems more reasonable to me. At the very least we need something to counter psychic powers, which I expect we will get. I just wouldn't count on anything else to make up for having no psykers. It's not like other psykerless armies like ad mech have anything to replace psykers so I wouldn't count on it for us either.

Ad-mech get canticles.. Tau get marklights and rules like supporting fire and the buffs provided by a fire blade or etheral

Yes and we get power from pain. Those are army wide special rules, definetly do not fall into the category of psychic powers or psychic like powers. The comparison I think that matters is abilities like c'tan powers, where an army with no psykers has a model with psyker like abilities. Could we have some tech used by haemonculi that act like powers? Yeah that would be cool, but I doubt we'll get powers like that, just like how ad mech and tau have no powers like that.

Though I think Tau actually do have psy-like abilities, the commanders decoration of Mont'ka or Kyu'yan and the Ethereal's "choose your own aura" along with marker lights (might as well just be a "marker lights" phase instead of a psychic phase for Tau cause yer more than likely gonna shoot all the marker lights first) kinda take the place of psychers in that army ... I don't really know anything about ad-mech, but even comparing what the Tau have with what we have ... I think the Tau are closer to "psycher like abilities" than we are ...

Someone mentioned that DE could have skaven-like army characteristics and it would be fun. What if power from pain was like the Screaming Bell? If you're not familiar it went like this:

Each turn you roll a dice. 1-6 had different abilities tied to each number. Turn 2 you roll a 2 dice, add them together for your new result. Turn 3 was 3 dice, and so on. If you dice totaled 20+ then something negative would happen.

It is a little late now to ask for things like that, but that system would work for me. Maybe change it so you get 1 dice per unit lost (friend/foe). The more pain on the battlefield, the more power you had.

While that'd certainly be cool, I don't think GW is going to deviate much, if at all from the current Power from Patience. Really, I'm not entirely certain PfP will change at all.

Are there any examples of an army rule changing from index to codex?

Mppqlmd wrote:

Crucible of malediction could be reworked : "Psychers within 18" suffer a peril from the Warp if they roll a double of any value. In case of Peril from the Warp, they suffer twice the normal MW".

I just don't think this is strong enough. Not compared to the output generated from those armies with psychers. I like the concept, but if we get no offensive ability in the phase, then wouldn't you think the DE would figure out a way to significantly limit others' abilities?

Sarkesian wrote:

Someone mentioned that DE could have skaven-like army characteristics and it would be fun. What if power from pain was like the Screaming Bell? If you're not familiar it went like this:

Each turn you roll a dice. 1-6 had different abilities tied to each number. Turn 2 you roll a 2 dice, add them together for your new result. Turn 3 was 3 dice, and so on. If you dice totaled 20+ then something negative would happen.

It is a little late now to ask for things like that, but that system would work for me. Maybe change it so you get 1 dice per unit lost (friend/foe). The more pain on the battlefield, the more power you had.

I think the concept is cool...but at this point, I would love to see something that isn't based on randomness for our army. I don't want luck of a roll to dictate whether or not my army is going to work the way I want it to. Alternatively, I don't want to always game-plan based on significant variability. I could be alone on this.

Agree. Dark Eldar should be an army where skill is more important than luck.

Choose your PFP effect every turn or roll twice and take both, that could work. Similar mechanic is for one thousand son effect.

SushiBoy013 wrote:

I think the concept is cool...but at this point, I would love to see something that isn't based on randomness for our army. I don't want luck of a roll to dictate whether or not my army is going to work the way I want it to. Alternatively, I don't want to always game-plan based on significant variability. I could be alone on this.

Making the crucible good is simple - just make it not a one-use item.

krayd wrote:

SushiBoy013 wrote:

I think the concept is cool...but at this point, I would love to see something that isn't based on randomness for our army. I don't want luck of a roll to dictate whether or not my army is going to work the way I want it to. Alternatively, I don't want to always game-plan based on significant variability. I could be alone on this.

Making the crucible good is simple - just make it not a one-use item.

Yeah, this edition has demonstrated a very large jump in power within the codexed armies. I don't think this would be OP in 8th edition, in fact - I think it would fit in quite well.

Personally, I'd like to see us get something equivelant to a Gloom Prism, a device that allowes us to Deny the Witch but not cast powers. If you could take it on HQ's and squad leaders that would be excellent.

+1 to the deny the witch idea. not in favour of any psykers in DE, because of their stance in regards to psykers and slaanesh and all. However, I also don't see them going into battle, meeting a psyker and going "oh well we're toast then". I expect them to have them to have tricks and items to mess those psykers up. Wether that is a new court peep who is psychic blank/null character or something that inhibits their ability to use their psychic powers. Coven are probably the route to these items/ tricks/abilities but hopefully not exclusively.

Coven with their tricks and shenanigans should be our psykers

CptMetal wrote:

Coven with their tricks and shenanigans should be our psykers

I doubt this will happen fortunately.
I don't miss the psykers, I do miss protection against them and the power they hold.
But with barely any reroll aura's and no psykic powers we miss some support, we need that in some way, but I would rather not have it as psykers.
(when other points cost are better the mortal wounds smite absence is less of an issue (mandrakes, grots, haywire, lahmeans give us some option to do mortal wounds and we should bring the right tool for the job not have the always deal damage against everything button).

Well if we are lucky the Archon's aura will be switched from his fairly useless one to the standard reroll 1s aura for nearby kabalite units.

And make heat lances and shredder useful again

CptMetal wrote:

Coven with their tricks and shenanigans should be our psykers

No, they should not be, we should not have Psykers at all since it's so heavily ingraned into our fluff for the last 20+ years.

Lord Asvaldir wrote:

Well if we are lucky the Archon's aura will be switched from his fairly useless one to the standard reroll 1s aura for nearby kabalite units.

And it would still be useless because we're not a gunline army, my guys in transports wont get any benefit.

CptMetal wrote:

And make heat lances and shredder useful again

Has there ever been an edition where the Shredder was useful? Certianly not since the 5th ed codex.